The Future of the Church Is Collaborative | Melanie Wise
What could happen if churches stopped working in isolation and started seeing themselves as one body?
Melanie Wise, Executive Director of Together Nashville, joins Mike Glenn to talk about church unity, pastoral loneliness, collaboration, and what God is doing across Nashville to bring churches and leaders together.
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Mike Glenn: Melanie Wise Yes ... welcome to the podcast. Thanks for joining us.
Melanie Wise: Man, thank you so
Mike Glenn: much. Now tell us what you're doing with Together Nashville.
Melanie Wise: Yes. Oh, my goodness. Together Nashville is a, is pretty, a pretty new initiative in the city, although it's been getting kind of discussed around the city for many years.
Mm-hmm. Um, but ultimately the heart of Together Nashville is to, to foster a greater unity within the Body of Christ around the city, to foster more collaboration around the city, uh, ultimately for the flourishing of Nashville. Mm-hmm. That the city of Nashville would, um, would be better, um, because of the fact that the Church is more united and collaborative.
Yeah, the, the- So that's kind of the- ... the Jeremiah 29- ... overarching vision ...
Mike Glenn: commandment,
Melanie Wise: right? That's right. Yes, yes. "Pray
Mike Glenn: for the wellbeing of the city-
Melanie Wise: That's right ... for
Mike Glenn: as it thrives, you will thrive also."
Melanie Wise: You will thrive, yes. And, um, and another really core foundational, um, scripture for us is John 17. Right.[00:01:00]
When, you know, and it's one of those scriptures that I'd read my whole life, but until I really kind of entered this space, I was like, "I don't think I've really ever seen that part." You know? Right. When those kind of things happen, and that Jesus is saying that, "The world is gonna know that I came- Mm-hmm
and that you love them as you love me because my followers are one." Yeah, right, because of the unity of the followers. Yeah. Oh, my God, I always heard about, like, unity, unity, yeah. Mm-hmm. But, like, that, that He tied it to, like, His mission- Mm-hmm ... was something that had never- And the validation
Mike Glenn: of His mission.
Melanie Wise: That's right. That's right. Mm-hmm. And so, yeah, I think one of the questions that we would ask the church of our city is, man, if this was what Jesus prayed for- Mm-hmm ... and, and to me, that says that Jesus knew that disunity was a threat to the mission, you know? Right. Oh, yeah. How are we, how are we doing? Like, what are we, what are we doing to try to engage in that way?
'Cause I think, a- and I can, I will confess that I was, I was one of the people who kind of went to that place of hearing about the idea of [00:02:00] unity and collaboration. I'm like, I've been in vocational ministry around Middle Tennessee for 20-plus years. Mm-hmm. And the first time I heard about it, I was just like, "Well, that sounds like a big old dream."
You're right. Yeah. How, how are you gonna do that? Yeah. You know? How you... It just feels almost, can feel insurmountable. Yeah,
Mike Glenn: especially when you know some of the players.
Melanie Wise: Right.
Mike Glenn: It's like, "Uh,
Melanie Wise: n- that's-" You've been
Mike Glenn: here long enough. I know ... "that is not
Melanie Wise: gonna work." I don't know how you ever see that happening.
And I'll be honest, I, from the outset, I had a moment of realizing, oh, this vision is impossible. if the Holy Spirit does not do a work. Right.
Mm-hmm.
Melanie Wise: I cannot come up with enough good ideas. We cannot come up with enough programs or enough con- you know, convincing, um, presentations to shift that in this city.
Mm-hmm. It's gonna require a real true move of God. And so, I mean, from the get-go, I was like, man, again, I have been in ministry for all of my adult life, and never have I been [00:03:00] involved in something that has me more desperate for the move of God. And I wish I could say that about all my previous roles. Yeah.
But I've just never been more aware in a work that I've done, this doesn't happen if you don't do this, Lord. Like, uh- Right ... so I wanna be faithful to play our part, but we, there is a desperation that I have for, for a move of God that I've never experienced-
Mike Glenn: What are you desperate for? ... before.
Melanie Wise: So, oh, that's such a great question.
I am desperate for the Lord to, to move on the hearts of the believers, and especially the faith leaders around our city, to... I, I, even when we hold gatherings, I'm just like, "Lord, would you do something in their hearts that draws them to one another?" Mm-hmm. That, that, um, opens their eyes to maybe those areas where, um, division has torn us apart, and that it breaks their hearts.
Mm-hmm. That it's like, whoa, if this is what Jesus prayed- I see the brokenness. I see how we're not [00:04:00] there. Mm-hmm. And how can we lean in to be part of kind of the answer to that prayer? And, and that there would be... And I, I've seen the Lord do it in some of these spaces where we're bringing faith leaders together.
And again, I go into those rooms going, "Lord, I can't, I can't draw their hearts to one another. I, I, I don't know how to do that." Mm-hmm. "But you can." And then these, these just sweet moments of connections that happen in the room, because I'm convinced that the Holy Spirit moved in that space, where there are pastors who've never sat down at a table together, but they're learning about each other's stories.
They're starting to pray over one another. Mm-hmm. I've heard about faith leaders in the city who at the he- on the heels of some of those gatherings are like, "Let's get together." Yeah. Like, "I wanna have lunch together. I wanna hear more about your story and I wanna hear more about..." And they're connecting as brothers and sisters first.
And that is, that is ultimately my hope and prayer, is that this isn't just because collaboration is a good strategic decision. Mm-hmm. Like, you're gonna get more done or you're gonna get to see more fruit. Those things are true. [00:05:00] But ultimately, to draw the family of God together and to see w- like, deep wounds and historical divides begin to heal, like, that's requiring-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm
Melanie Wise: a move of God. So- Yeah ... what is our part in that and, and providing those opportunities, but then true, like, the desperation for God to do what only God can do in the hearts of his people.
Mike Glenn: How did you end up in this ministry?
Melanie Wise: That's a good question. What, uh- Yes. I... So when I first moved to the Middle Tennessee area right out of college, uh, came to do the music thing, 'cause that's what you do- Mm-hmm
right? You move to Nashville. Um, and very, very quickly m- realized, whoa, this is not the path that the Lord has for me here. And I ended up working at a church in, um, Franklin, and was there for about seven years. Mm-hmm. And then I ended up working at a nonprofit, faith-based nonprofit, for the [00:06:00] last 13 years.
And so, again, had seen, um- The beauty of the church. Mm-hmm. And I'd seen the brokenness- Mm ... of the church as well. And I think, um, there is... It's funny because it's like sometimes you don't even know something that the Lord has put inside of you until it's kind of called out. Mm. You know? And there was something about the vision of Together Nashville that was very compelling, very, like, again, kind of that how in the world does that ever happen in our city?
Mm. I don't know. But it started to bring some things alive inside of me that, just even, some of it was just burdens that I have felt, but also just certain wirings I felt like that the Lord has put inside of me- Mm ... that just felt so drawn to this work. And so I, I knew some of the people who'd been kind of ideating on this for a few years.
Um, and so they had shared, shared about the idea with me, the vision with me. And, uh, again, a lot of faith leaders around the city had been talking about it- Mm-hmm ... but I think they kind of reached [00:07:00] that juncture of, "We need someone." And there's been sporadic
Mike Glenn: moments. Yes. There
Melanie Wise: was the Billy
Mike Glenn: Graham crusade.
Melanie Wise: Absolutely.
Mike Glenn: And, and, and that kind of stuff where-
Melanie Wise: And Operation Andrew group that came out of it. Yeah, Operation Andrew sort of comes out of that. Beautiful work.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Melanie Wise: And I can truly say Um, as I've entered into this kind of space, and as I've, I've spent the better part of the last year and a half having a lot of lunches and a lot of coffees Mm
around the city, but just meeting faith leaders, meeting pastors, ministry leaders around the city, I have such a growing awareness of how it's, this is not the first time this conversation- Mm ... has been had around our city, and there have been pastors that have been contending for this for years and years and years.
And I have such a sense of like, Lord, like, we're just being called into the story that you have already been writing. Mm-hmm. I will say that I have more hope than I could have ever had, um, before of what God is doing in our city right now, and I'm hearing this from pastors who've been here for decades.
So I'm like, okay, [00:08:00] it's one thing for me to be kind of new to this space- Mm ... and new to these conversations and go, "I feel like God's really doing something." But to hear this from people who've been in the city and, and ministering in the city for decades- Mm ... to go, "Something is happening now," and I'm hearing it enough and seeing it enough with my own eyes, that I do just have such a sense of, oh my goodness, God is doing something in our city that He was doing well before Together Nashville came on the scene- Mm-hmm
and that He's gonna continue to do well after. But w- we just get our one part. We just get this one season of time to try to be faithful to what our part is in this- Mm ... knowing that we are one of many people that carry this burden and this heart for the city.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, one of the things that I s- that I learned to look for if, if we thought God was doing something is did, did He affirm and confirm that among the membership?
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: Okay. Mm-hmm. Hey, we got an idea maybe. Will you just be quiet and watch?
Melanie Wise: Yes.
Mike Glenn: If people with certain gifts and talents started showing up and going, [00:09:00] "Hey, I have this passion- Mm. ... or I have this burden, and I think we could do this," then we, that would be the affirmation- Yes,
Melanie Wise: yes ...
Mike Glenn: that we were looking for.
Melanie Wise: Yes.
Um. Absolutely. And that, I think, is what I have been honestly a little pleasantly surprised to see. I'm like, "This is, this is resonating with people." Mm-hmm. Um, I feel like there is so much of kind of even my own personal passion and heart that I bring into this is going, man, I've seen the weight of pastoral leadership.
Mm-hmm. Part of that was in, when I worked at the church for a few years, and then even the wo- the work that I did at the nonprofit was a, there was a lot of just kind of partnering and coming alongside pastors and, and, and pastoral leaders in churches. And just knowing the, the weight, the overwhelm, the, um, the, just what they carry.
Mike Glenn: How, how have you seen that, uh, lived out in the lives of the pastors? Uh- [00:10:00] Yeah ... because we talk about-
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm ...
Mike Glenn: a lot about how pastors have to take good care of themselves if they're gonna take- Mm-hmm ... good care of- Mm ... their, their congregations. Mm-hmm.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Okay. Yes. And, and one of the things that we find out is how lonely pastors are, how separated they are- Yes
how- Yes ... how many of them are in crisis and don't know who to call.
Melanie Wise: Yes, yes. And I think that is what... I, I think that that's one of the reasons that this idea of coming together and unity and friendship amongst the leaders in our city- Mm-hmm ... is resonating because I saw that at, within one context. But now I think I'm starting to see that more across the city, pastors who are like, "I would actually love to come into a room to simply sit with other leaders across the city and just get to know one another and build- Mm-hmm
relationships." I genuinely was surprised at how many were just hungry for that. I just need friends in this thing- Mm-hmm ... you know? And so [00:11:00] I, I think there's the relational aspect of that, of having that community. Um, but I also think there's, like, the missional piece of that, of going... I mean, I saw it. Again, now I was, like, in my 20s, and I am serving, uh, as one of the youth ministers at the- Mm-hmm
church where I was, and I didn't know better. No one told me that the weight of all of these, you know, young people's- All the stories- ... spiritual journeys ... that they
Mike Glenn: tell you, yeah- Right ... that you end up carrying, right.
Melanie Wise: I gotta carry this. Mm-hmm. And, and, and I, you know, blessed that I did have parents in our church who, you know, would imply, like, their spiritual wellbeing is now-
Mike Glenn: That's why we hired you.
Melanie Wise: Right. Yeah. 23-year-old like, "Oh, sure. I got this," you know? Mm-hmm. And, and I had no different... I had no one to be able to kind of maybe particularly say like, "That's actually not your weight to carry." That, you know. So I just think, um- I, and I know that that is a pressure that even people who've got strong support and people speaking into their life- Mm-hmm
like so many of the ways that I know you're pouring [00:12:00] into leaders, and that you even, you know, I, like the leaders that I know that have come out of Brentwood Baptist over the years- Mm-hmm ... that I even was able to sit under, people like Aaron Bryant. Like, I know the kind of support and care that you had for them, and the way that you built them up and continue to do so.
So I'm just so grateful for that. Um, and I just see that even with support and even with the wisdom of people, it can be so easy to start feeling like, "I carry-
Mike Glenn: That's right,
Melanie Wise: yeah ... I carry this." As much as you can know what is true. And so I have such a heart to say, "Go. You know, the weight of this city is not on you alone."
And there are, there are 700 pastors around Middle Tennessee- Mm-hmm ... that are lo- that wanna serve and love this city and this community. And what does it look like to come together and serve in a more connected and collaborative way so that you have a real tangible way to go, "Oh, I'm not alone." Mm-hmm. I, yes, relationally I'm not alone, but also [00:13:00] missionally in this city, there are people who carry the same heart, um, as, as maybe my congregation.
I, I'm always interested to know, like, what is God laying on the hearts of specific churches and specific- Right ... pastors, and how is God uniquely wiring your congregation to serve the city? 'Cause guess what? You do not have to do it all. No. You really don't have to do it all. And when you get connected to that larger system, you realize, oh, like, all of you guys are serving this community.
All of you are serving this issue. We don't have to do it all ourselves. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: We remind people all the time that everybody has a gift.
Melanie Wise: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: No one has all the gifts.
Melanie Wise: Yes.
Mike Glenn: Because there's something about us working together- Hmm ... that brings glory and honor to God in a way that one person doing it can't.
That's
Melanie Wise: right. That's right. That's right.
Mike Glenn: And that's- And when the world sees, we don't know how that's a team.
Melanie Wise: Hmm.
Mike Glenn: We don't know how they work with them to do
Melanie Wise: this- Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm ...
Mike Glenn: that they say, "Okay, maybe there is something to this God
Melanie Wise: thing." There's something there. Yeah. There's something there.
Mike Glenn: And, and do that.
Melanie Wise: Yeah. We talk about, uh, like what would it look like [00:14:00] for there to be, like, a shocking unity?
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Melanie Wise: Because, I mean, goodness knows, in, in our polarized world today, unity is shocking. Yeah. Um, and, and for there to be people who go, like, "What is it that holds those people together?" Yeah. "'Cause they should not be in a room together.
That doesn't make any sense that they would be- No ... in community with one another."
Mike Glenn: Or play friends,
Melanie Wise: yeah. Absolutely. So just to be curious of, like, what is it that's keeping them together? Mm-hmm. Um, yeah. So yeah, I, I, um, I am very hopeful that this, you know, that Together Nashville providing opportunities for people to connect relationally, c- to connect missionally, to explore collaboration, again,
Mike Glenn: just help- How, how does, how does, uh, Together Nashville do that?
Is it workshops?
Melanie Wise: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Coffee, lunches? If you go- if, if you're gonna be pastors, you're gonna have food there somehow.
Melanie Wise: That's true. So. Food, I have learned it will [00:15:00] bring the people. Serve some good food. That's it. It matters. It matters. It does matter. Um, yes. So, um, to date, we have really been focused on that relational building, like building, building those friendships, building trust.
Mm-hmm. Um, and I do believe that there's a day coming that we will lean into even going, "Man, what does it look like for us to provide opportunities for some of that deeper unity work," the hard unity work where we start actually having dialogue around the things, like historical things- Mm ... that have divided us, um, whether that's r- racially or culturally or politically.
Um, goodness gracious, like theologically, the things that have really been strong divis- dividing walls. Mm. Um, and there's just beautiful work that I've seen coming out of some other cities. I, um, we're connected with a larger kind of group of people c- um, under something called the City Leaders Collective.
Mm-hmm. And so these are all just people in their cities that are kind of trying to lead out this kind of work. And so there's just some beautiful [00:16:00] things happening in cities around the country where there's opportunities being made for people that are very, very different and have historically been very, very divided- Mm-hmm
to come together over the course of time and have some dialogue and even some healing conversations around that. So I would love to see us lean into that eventually. Mm-hmm. Um, so that's more on the relational side. But then, um, when it comes to kind of like addressing the needs of our city, we honestly have still been in such early formation of going like, "Who all is doing what around the city?"
And I- Right ... am utterly blown away by how many incredible human beings are in this city. Mm-hmm. I just never cease to be amazed at the c- the people that God has brought to this city. But, you know, we kind of are trying to just be aware of where does there seem... I, I like what you just said earlier about kind of like if there's something that's kind of stirring, we go- Mm-hmm
"Okay, who else?" And we'll just see. Mm-hmm. We'll just see what Holy Spirit is doing over in this kind of area or this issue in our city. And so a real kind of more tangible one that's [00:17:00] even coming up soon is I started hearing a lot of people talking about disaster response. Mm-hmm. And like the, the body of Christ, the, the Church just seems to be pretty disconnected in this space.
You know, maybe denominationally there's more kind of going on. Mm-hmm. But like what does it look like for the Church, the faith community, to be better connected in this- Mm-hmm ... specific space?
Mike Glenn: Well, you know, the, the history of Nashville was when the tornado hit. The community responded so well-
Melanie Wise: Mm. Mm ...
Mike Glenn: that it didn't get the news coverage that it actually- Mm
Melanie Wise: deserved. Mm.
Mike Glenn: And when the news finally did show up-
Melanie Wise: Mm ...
Mike Glenn: you know, the CE- the CNNs and that kind of thing, they were walking around town going, and talking to our friends, going-
Melanie Wise: Mm ... "
Mike Glenn: We had no idea this was happening." Wow. Because nobody was complaining. Neighbors went, you know-
Melanie Wise: Wow ...
Mike Glenn: uh, The Kairos, you know, you were part of Kairos where- Yes, yes
those guys went door to door. I remember. Would just get in the car- Yes ... and drive down and just go door to door helping people. That's
Melanie Wise: right.
Mike Glenn: Yes. Uh, and that kind, and that happened all over the city.
Melanie Wise: Yes, and I [00:18:00] remember the... I was here for the flood.
Mike Glenn: Oh,
Melanie Wise: yeah. And just even seeing, like, the power of people just coming together- Mm-hmm
to serve and love their city, and I think that was a seed planted in that time- Mm-hmm ... of just, of, of seeing what happens when people can come together. And, and quite frankly, disaster response is a it's a little bit easier for people to go, like, "I don't need to agree with you on baptism-" Yeah, but- "... to go serve our neighbor who need," you know?
To cut down, to cut down a tree off his house, right, yeah. To cut down a tree. That's right. But I, but so what Together Nashville is doing specifically in that space is going, "Hey, you know, we've built a lot of different connections and relationships around the city. We're gonna set a table for a conversation."
Mm-hmm. "We're not trying to, to be an authority in this space or tell you all what you should do," but there seems to be some energy for better collaboration in the future. So let's just get in a room together. We do have someone who actually knows what they're talking about coming in to facilitate that- Right
'cause I do not need to be facilitating that conversation.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. But even if it was just the, the city knows there's one number to call.
Melanie Wise: Right. Oh, [00:19:00] yes. Yeah. What a dream.
Mike Glenn: We, we've got, we've got a problem, and there's one number.
Melanie Wise: Yes.
Mike Glenn: And when we call that number, then, then everybody will be
Melanie Wise: mobilized. To mobilize, absolutely.
That would be a dream. That would be amazing. And so, yeah, I, I, I will say I didn't know what the response would be. I'd had some conversations- Mm-hmm ... with some different people, Vicki Howell of Brentwood Baptist- Right ... being one of them, and we're like, "Well, let's just, let's just call a few people together and see what happens in that space."
And so I was hoping for maybe, like, 15, 20 people might be willing to come together to have a conversation, and we're, we're getting close to 60 now who've registered to come from churches all over and ministries all over the
Mike Glenn: city. Oh, if you give guys time to gr- you know, play with a chainsaw in a pickup truck.
Melanie Wise: They're ready. Oh,
Mike Glenn: man, what are you talking about?
Melanie Wise: Oh, my goodness. Oh, I have no idea what to expect out of that room, to be completely honest with, with you. But these are all people who... There are some people from the Tennessee Baptist Mission Board, like denominational leaders that are coming in, and some of them have actually said in response to our invitation, "It's about time- Yeah
someone called this [00:20:00] conversation together." Right. I'm like, okay. So if Together Nashville, uh, we've kind of, you know, likened it to if, if the Church is a body, then we wanna try to serve as ligaments. Mm-hmm. Like, just connective tissue around the city to go, "Okay, like we've built these relationships around the city, like, so when something like this comes up, let's get in a room.
Let's talk about how to be better connected going forward." I have no idea what's gonna come out of that conversation. Yeah. And that's not particularly our goal to, to tell or to dictate that, but to provide an opportunity for collaboration and see what happens. And then we, we'll support that as best we can into
Mike Glenn: the future.
But- Well, to your point that, uh, in Nashville, uh, and if you name an issue, we probably got one of the better nonprofits dealing with it.
Melanie Wise: Absolutely.
Mike Glenn: Uh, I mean, it's kinda crazy in Middle Tennessee about that. Yes. Uh, but to have an opportunity to, to convene a meeting- Mm-hmm ... where others can learn. Mm-hmm.
"Here's how, here's what we have learned."
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm. "
Mike Glenn: So that when you're starting it in [00:21:00] your church, you don't make the same mistakes again." Mm.
Melanie Wise: Yes,
Mike Glenn: yes. You know, as I tell people, wisdom means I screwed up before you did. That's good. That's, that's all wisdom is. Yes, yes. Now I have the scar, so don't do that.
That's right. That's right.
Melanie Wise: Yes.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, that's important. Um, so if you can create those kind of conversations-
Melanie Wise: Yeah ...
Mike Glenn: where, where, where people can share.
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: Um, because there's nothing more validating to your ministry than somebody else asking To help me. Show me
Melanie Wise: how you did this Mm. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Okay. Yes, yes.
And there's some even wonderful connecting groups that have done that in the city. I mean, Unite the Light is something- Mm-hmm ... that's come out of Brentwood Baptist. Mm-hmm. And Mission Increase, and these groups of, that are just bringing the non-profit community together to just learn from one another-
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
See, I told people all the time- ... encourage one another ... when I was pastor at Brentwood, whatever you wanted to do, there was somebody in the church who was top two or three in the nation in doing that. That's
Melanie Wise: so true.
Mike Glenn: Would volunteer for anything.
Melanie Wise: Yes.
Mike Glenn: You know, w- which you went and found them-
Melanie Wise: Yes ...
Mike Glenn: [00:22:00] and said, "Hey, here's what I'm doing."
"Oh, yeah, I can do that." And bam.
Melanie Wise: That's so true. That's so true.
Mike Glenn: You know? And-
Melanie Wise: Yeah. And-
Mike Glenn: And so the, we have an entire city of that kind- Mm ... of talent, passion, and all
Melanie Wise: that. That's right. That's right
Mike Glenn: That if we could mobilize it and f- uh, give, give it bones-
Melanie Wise: Mm. Mm-hmm ... you
Mike Glenn: know, to hang on to.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm. Yes,
Mike Glenn: yes You, you gotta have some kind of skeleton or the body doesn't work.
Melanie Wise: Some sort of... I know. That's, yeah- Yeah ... a, a being kind of like a, a, a backbone-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Melanie Wise: um, agency to help connect those different pieces. And, and I do think there's part of it that, um, I've... and I've heard this in different rooms, especially with pastors who've just said like, "We don't know where to go to find out who- Okay, right
is doing what." Yeah. And we're like, "Okay. I mean- Yeah. If I could call you- ... maybe
Mike Glenn: that's a gap" ... and say, "Hey, we're interested in learning this. Who's best?"
Melanie Wise: Right.
Mike Glenn: Right And you can put me there, then you've already given them the, the Goodwill seal of approval.
Melanie Wise: Right, right.
Mike Glenn: And I don't have to do all the background checks- Mm
and everything else. And I can save, save a lot of time like that.
Melanie Wise: Yes, yes. Well, and then hopefully that can reduce some of the maybe unnecessary [00:23:00] duplication of work. Right. And I'm not... You know, when someone says, "I have a heart to start a new thing," and I'm like, "Great." Mm-hmm. "And maybe that is exactly what the Lord has called you to do.
You should know about-
Mike Glenn: Yeah. And see, what- ... these
Melanie Wise: people as well" ... what,
Mike Glenn: what we did was when, uh, you know, the big thing was, "Let's find out your gifts and what God wants you to do, and what He wants you to be involved in."
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And we would have a lot of people say, "I have a passion for this." Mm-hmm. Okay. Then we're gonna send you down to Hope Clinic.
Melanie Wise: That's right. Yes.
Mike Glenn: Okay? 'Cause we don't need to reinvent that wheel. Yes. They've already done it. Mm. I'm gonna give them a call and give them a heads-up. You do that.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Uh, a- and, and, and- And it just saved us so much time and- Yeah ... effort and m- we don't need-
Melanie Wise: Yep ...
Mike Glenn: you know, better to have one that's really doing it well than- That's right
100 mediocre-
Melanie Wise: Oh, it's so
Mike Glenn: good ... uh, kind of things.
Melanie Wise: Yes. I feel like, I feel like Brentwood Baptist has done a, a really beautiful job of that, of partnering with a nonprofit community- Mm-hmm ... um, and doing exactly what you described, of just, like, of, of just pointing people at... [00:24:00] You carry that heart. And there is, there is such a need for volunteering and serving within your local church- Mm-hmm
and it matters, and I think one of the things that I've seen so much that's come out of Brentwood Baptist is just, like... And, and also, we know you carry passion in other thing- Yes ... the PLACE Ministry, I don't know- Yeah, yeah ... if PLACE is still going there. Yeah, sure is. Yeah. But man, that was so, such a good way to go, how do we connect you missionally in the city and what is- Mm-hmm
happening around? I mean, did such a wonderful job. Yeah. And, and that's a dynamic that can happen around the city, is kind of that, the congregation-nonprofit relationship can be- Mm ... a little bit rocky. Yeah. And I just think you all, uh, did such a wonderful job, and I'm sure continue to do a wonderful job of bridging that- Mm-hmm
and going, "There, there is a... We are all part of the body. We are all part of the church," and not seeing maybe the nonprofit community as other, but part of. Right. And how do we bridge that? Mm-hmm. I just think it was done so beautifully. Now,
Mike Glenn: I wanted to follow up before we get too far down this road here. Y- y- a lot of, of, of what [00:25:00] you have discovered is about the loneliness of pastors.
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: So tell me about what you have found
Melanie Wise: out. You know, it's interesting. Um, in a, in a very different way, I feel like I have personally experienced a different kind of loneliness as I stepped into this role, um, where I realized, oh- Wearing, like even an executive director hat- Mm-hmm ... is different than any other hat that I've worn.
Mm-hmm. And there's a different weight to it- Mm-hmm ... that I wake up with every morning, where I've been on senior leadership teams, I've been on church staffs, but I have never worn this hat where it's like the decisions that I am making every day is shaping the entire direction of- Mm-hmm ... an entire thing.
Mm-hmm. Like, that's a different weight. And so I have, I have realized, like, this is a l- I'm feeling lonely already, like immediately. It was weird, because I'm like, I don't know how many other people feel this way. I know there's a lot of executive [00:26:00] directors out there, but even women in this space. Mm-hmm. And so I immediately was looking for women who, who know what this feels like.
Mm-hmm. And as I sat down with them and I said, "I just wanna be around women that are leading in this space, that, that are leading in a way that I wanna emulate, that I wanna learn from." Mm-hmm. Um, and, and what I would hear back from them is, "Oh, yes," like, "We should get together," you know? I'm like, "Oh, y'all don't already get together?"
Yeah. Yeah. Like, "Yes, we should get together." And there... And I've learned that there are, there are places where that's happening. But I realized there's something about sitting alongside people who understand what you're carrying- Mm-hmm ... because they also carry that in their own way. Mm-hmm. Um, and so yeah.
You know, like, there's a group of women that I'm now connecting with, that are CEOs and executive directors of nonprofits, but that just understand that- Mm ... in a way that not everybody can fully understand. So now I have almost a different level of understanding, especially for lead pastors. [00:27:00] 'Cause I just know, in theory, not because I've ever worn that hat, but there is a weight to that, that no one can fully comprehend unless you've done it.
Mm-hmm. Or you're doing it. And so- I now, I think in a different way, understand the, the need. Yes, I want faith leaders in this city to have friendships and relationships, but the loneliness of the lead pastor- Mm ... has to feel like a different type of lonely, you know? Mm-hmm. And so as I'm sitting, as I'm having conversations with lead pastors, I know that there are beautiful places where pastors are coming together and building those kinds of friendships around the city.
It is happening, and I'm so encouraged by that. Um, but now I just feel, like, such a deep desire to, every time I meet a pastor, of just going like, "Do you have that kind of community?" Mm. And, and a lot of times they do, or they have two or three pastors they meet with, and they kind of share that together. Um, but m- wanting to be sure that they, that every pastor in this city has [00:28:00] that.
Yeah. And if they don't, how can I connect you with the places where I know that's happening? To somebody, yeah. Somebody like that. And I've been able to be in the rooms where I'm seeing lead pastors come together and bear each other's burdens and cry together and pray over one another, speak life into each other.
And I mean, it brings me to tears every time- Mm-hmm ... 'cause I'm like, "This is what the body looks like." Yeah. This is what family looks like, encouragement, and really, like, spurring one another on. It's just a-
Mike Glenn: But, you know, for years ... beautiful thing. I mean, this, this ability to reach across denominations-
Melanie Wise: Mm ...
Mike Glenn: is a recent-
Melanie Wise: Mm
Mike Glenn: development. I mean, when I was just getting started-
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm ...
Mike Glenn: uh, there were Southern Baptists and them.
Melanie Wise: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: And, and everybody else was them.
Melanie Wise: That's right. Right. Yes, yes.
Mike Glenn: And, and to all of them, Southern Baptists- Mm ... were-
Melanie Wise: Them ...
Mike Glenn: them.
Melanie Wise: Right.
Mike Glenn: Uh, so, so that's- Mm ... a recent thing. Mm. But I think one of the things that we're finding out is that, uh- [00:29:00] If, if we don't stick together-
Melanie Wise: Hmm
Mike Glenn: in some kind of way- Mm-hmm ... there won't be anybody.
Melanie Wise: Mm. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: You know, what's the old joke? They came for, they came for this and I wasn't that and-
Melanie Wise: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: You know, and I- Right. And finally they came f- they came for me- Mm ... and there wasn't anybody left
Melanie Wise: to speak up. Mm.
Mike Glenn: But, you know, I used to, I used to, people used to be shocked at me 'cause I would sit down with them and go, "What are you looking for in a church?
What are you looking for?" Mm. And they would say, "Well, we love this kind of worship." And I would tell them, "That's not us."
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: That's the, we don't, we don't do it that way. And if you come here-
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm ...
Mike Glenn: you're gonna be mad every Sunday. And, and we're eventually- Oh ... gonna get mad with you.
Melanie Wise: Right. But,
Mike Glenn: but I know- Oh, man
who does that worship. Yes. And I know who does it well. So let me call them-
Melanie Wise: Wow ...
Mike Glenn: and tell them you're coming.
Melanie Wise: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: And they would go, I said, "Listen, we work for the same boss."
Melanie Wise: So good.
Mike Glenn: We work for the same boss. My job isn't to get you in my church. Mm. My job is to get you to where Jesus wants you. That's
Melanie Wise: right.
Mike Glenn: Okay? Now, if I've done that [00:30:00] and, and, and we can facilitate that, then I'm happy to do that. Mm. And I wanna be your friend, but I'm gonna disappoint you every Sunday you come.
Melanie Wise: That's good. That's good. That's
Mike Glenn: really good. You know, I d- I don't wear a robe. As if
Melanie Wise: you've experienced
Mike Glenn: that before. And if you're looking- Yeah
and if you're looking for me to wear a robe- Yeah ... you're gonna be mad every time you see me Sunday.
Melanie Wise: Oh, man, that's so good. So. That's such wisdom. But man, it's funny because as you're saying that, I'm thinking about, um, my peers who kind of lead similar works in their cities and it's interesting to talk to my peers in Portland- Mm-hmm
or in New York City or in the Bay Area, and I'm like, "Oh, we are not in the same- Mm ... we're not in the same world." No. Um, and I think there is such a, not to say that there's not division and things, uh, anywhere, but I think there is an inclination and a, and an understanding, like if we don't, if we don't stick together in Portland- Yeah
you know? Like, there's just a hunger to be together- Right ... maybe that isn't as
Mike Glenn: felt [00:31:00] here. Well, I was with a group, interdenominational group the other night and I said, "You guys need to remember, those pastors in Africa aren't being killed because they're Church of Christ-
Melanie Wise: Mm ...
Mike Glenn: or because they're Baptists.
Yeah. Oof. They're being killed 'cause they're Christian."
Melanie Wise: That's right. That's right.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Uh. Yeah. And, and y- we're seeing that same kind of stuff happen, so-
Melanie Wise: Right ...
Mike Glenn: you know.
Melanie Wise: We might wanna-
Mike Glenn: You might wanna be sure- ... take note ... what d- what kind of jersey you're getting on.
Melanie Wise: That's good. No, that's really, really good.
Uh, with that. And I think it's interesting too because one of the things that I carry really in my heart for Together Nashville is really looking at the next generation.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Melanie Wise: And, you know, it's, it's more just things that I'm pondering and things that I'm just kind of praying through of like, man, I, I don't know that I'm seeing an, a generation that's really hungry for the structures that we've built.
Mike Glenn: No. Very different.
Melanie Wise: I think they're, they're ready for something different. Mm-hmm. Uh, and, and quite frankly, I sense, and the more conversations I have with young leaders around the city, the more I sense like, I think what you're hungry for [00:32:00] resembles something that looks more like how God architected His church to work than what- Mm
what you're getting handed. Yeah. And so what I'm sensing is, is that- Yeah, with- ... they're like- ...
Mike Glenn: with the transition of the boomers off- Mm ... of the stage. Mm. All the boomers are retiring now, and you've got the, the, the alphabet generations coming in.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Um, there is a, there is a tsunami of change hitting- Mm
Melanie Wise: the church- Mm-hmm ...
Mike Glenn: that will... Everything's fast now, so the change is gonna hit it like that. Mm. For instance, Gen X, we're always told, do not give. Millennials do not give.
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: They do give.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And they give generously.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: But they give to a particular person or a particular thing.
Melanie Wise: Mm, that's right. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Okay? They will not give to a bucket.
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: So if, if you and I were gonna pass a bucket and say- Mm-hmm ... "Hey, all our, all our mission work comes out of this"
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Not gonna do that.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. If you come in and say, "There's a family over here- Mm-hmm ... we're buying Thanksgiving dinner," they will give you the shirt off their back.
Melanie Wise: [00:33:00] Right. Right. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: So it's a very different way of- Yeah ... of talking about stewardship and-
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: And, uh- Mm-hmm ... money and investment. They will tell you they tithe.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Do you tithe? Yes. Mm-hmm. 10% of my income. 2% goes to a missionary I'm sponsoring in Guatemala. That's right. 3% goes to a s- to a student I'm putting through school in Uganda.
You know? Uh-huh. And another 2% goes to my church. Yeah. So it adds up to 10%.
Melanie Wise: Right. Right, I'm giving away 10%. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: But it's not the straight 10% to the church- Mm ... that, that my generation grew up with. That's right. So it's very, very different.
Melanie Wise: Well, and I mean, you've got- A genera- and I feel like I'm kind of like in between.
I'm in that, like, you know, I'm, I'm looking at a generation that I'm definitely older than- Right ... that are stepping up and stepping into places of leadership. Um, and I'm going, "Mm, I don't know if what's coming again is gonna connect with what- No ... y'all want." And, and I think you've got this whole generation who has, has [00:34:00] connection- Mm-hmm
like in their DNA. I mean, it's literally what they've been, for better or for worse. You know, there's this sense of like, "I can be connected to the whole world." Right. And so I'm actually very interested in what's happening across the whole city. Mm-hmm. And, and I'm, I'm meeting these, these young adults who they're like, "Yeah, we go to..."
And I mean, I think part of this is also being a young adult. It's like this is why something like Kairos was just so- Mm-hmm ... it's like, yeah, it's tied to Brentwood Baptist, but I don't go because I'm a Baptist, I go 'cause young- Right ... adults are connecting- Right ... in this place to worship the Lord, you know?
And so I think part of that is, is gener- is a generational thing. But also, I think there's this sense of w- we're tired of the division. Like we're, we wanna move forward together. Mm-hmm. We wanna be connected. We wanna support each other. And we've got this just, uh, even just kind of the idea of like how things like Uber and Facebook and Airbnb have like democratized-
Mike Glenn: Right
Melanie Wise: everything. It's like it's all a [00:35:00] platform and
Mike Glenn: it's all kinda- And I tell people I grew up in a church where we were told what not to do every Sunday.
Melanie Wise: Mm.
Mike Glenn: This is what you don't do.
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And then we'd get together the next Sunday and thank God we hadn't done anything.
Melanie Wise: Mm. Oh, man, yes. I've actually... I'm pretty sure I've heard you say that before.
Yeah, yeah. Now that you say that- Yes, that's right ... yes, it's so good. Oh, man. It's so good. But yeah, I think there's that sense of like anyone can kinda do anything now. Yeah. Like if you- Oh, yeah ... you know, there's not this hierarchical structure that we're kinda so used to. Even in things, like I said, like of, you know, it's like, what- Yeah, I don't wanna argue with you about things- There was a taxi service
that don't matter ... like we can all, we can all take people around. Yeah. And so it's kind of like going, okay- Y- the hierarchical structures aren't really appealing anymore to this next generation. It's just not what they're used to seeing in the world around them. Mm-hmm. And, and the fact that, that there's this desire for connection and for collaboration and knowing what everyone's doing- Mm-hmm
and the shared mission, and the shared like, I, I, I... My hope and prayer is that Together Nashville can be part [00:36:00] of helping provide a new framework and a new pathway for the church- Yeah ... for the, for the next generation.
Mike Glenn: I found it interesting on your website that the, the, the statement of faith, or the statement that, uh, Together Nashville has, has kinda gelled around-
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm
Mike Glenn: was the Nicene Creed.
Melanie Wise: Hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes.
Mike Glenn: Uh, that's not, that's not something you usually find laying around a table somewhere.
Melanie Wise: Good point.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Not framed and so, yeah. So how did your organization end up with the Nicene Creed?
Melanie Wise: Yeah. You know, I'll, I'll be honest with you. That was determined well before I came, came on, on board.
But I also, again, you know, connected with all these other cities. Many of the other cities have named the Nicene Creed kind of as like, their theological center. Right. Because at some point, you have to go like, "Well, what does it mean to engage with Together Nashville?" Mm-hmm. And do you, do you engage with this kind of church, or that kind of church, or what if they believe this?
D- you know, and you can get, you can get sucked into
Mike Glenn: a whirlwind. Well, I think it's important [00:37:00] for us to underline that this is not an interfaith organization. Correct.
Melanie Wise: That's right.
Mike Glenn: Okay.
Melanie Wise: That's right.
Mike Glenn: This is a multi-denominational-
Melanie Wise: Yes ...
Mike Glenn: but a very Christian- Yes ... denomination.
Melanie Wise: That's right. Yes.
Mike Glenn: And the statement-
Melanie Wise: Mm-hmm
the
Mike Glenn: centering statement is the Nicene Creed. Is the
Melanie Wise: Nicene Creed. And you know what's interesting is that when you really look at the Nicene Creed and you read the whole... I mean, it's like, there's a lot. Mm-hmm. There's a lot in here. And I almost wonder sometimes, have we, have we forgotten how incredible it is that we all agree with all of
Mike Glenn: this?
That's right. Yeah.
Melanie Wise: Like, when you really
Mike Glenn: read it- Well, and, and the great thing about those creeds is those things had been field tested.
Melanie Wise: That, yes, yes.
Mike Glenn: You know, these weren't, these weren't academic things. Mm-hmm. These are the things that we have found out in the living of the church.
Melanie Wise: Mm. Yes, yes.
Mike Glenn: And if we can agree on these- I-
handful of statements, then we'll be able to do everything else that we want to- That's right ... that we wanna see get done.
Melanie Wise: And, and that's our question is going, man, you know... And, and I mean, I'll say even for me personally, [00:38:00] um, I've, I've never been to seminary. I've never done a lot, a lot of deep diving into all of these different, you know- Mm-hmm
uh, denominational theological approaches. But I, I, like, I, when I look at that, I go I- this to me is like, this, this is the core. Right. This is like what, this is what differentiates the Christian faith- Mm-hmm ... from everyone else. But I did not know how many different streams of the Christian faith are aligned with the Nicene Creed.
That's, that's right. Yeah. I didn't know. I mean, and so- It's amazing ... I even met people who are part of-
Mike Glenn: Trace it all back.
Melanie Wise: Yeah. Yeah. And I'm, and I it's, it's, uh, I'm gonna be honest, telling myself here a little bit, but I've had conversations with p- people just randomly, like in a coffee shop, and they'll tell me what part, like what church they're part of, and I'm like, "I've never heard of that one."
Mm-hmm. And then I'm like looking them up when they leave. Mm-hmm. Like, are they Nicene Creed ali- Oh, my goodness. Yeah. I did not know that that stream of the Christian faith is aligned with the Nicene Creed. This is a much broader group, honestly, than I even knew going in. Mm-hmm. But I'm like, man, if we go, like this is what defines [00:39:00] us as the family of God, as Christians- Mm-hmm
as followers of Jesus, c- could we, could we sit around the table and acknowledge that we're in the same family if we're aligned with this? Right. And is there anything else that you would need to add to this to be able to acknowledge that we're in the same family? Yeah. If so, this might get a little weird for you, you know- Mm-hmm
if you're like, "I, I cannot sit down at the table and acknowledge that someone who disagrees with me on this or that issue- Mm-hmm ... on, on, you know, on baptism, or maybe on, on women in leadership, or even the LGBTQ conversation." Mm-hmm. "If I, if, if we don't agree on that, I cannot acknowledge that we're in the same family."
Yeah. Yeah. And if, if not, we're, there's no, uh, like we would never wanna push people past what they believe is right or wrong or condemn that. Right. But this is g- this Together Nashville space might get a little bit uncomfortable for you.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Because,
Melanie Wise: because- Because we would acknowledge that we are in the same
because
Mike Glenn: the center pole is the Nicene
Melanie Wise: Creed. That's right. That's right. So. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's been in- honestly, it's [00:40:00] been very, very helpful as a clarifying statement. Mm-hmm. When people go like, "Well, would you ever, do you agree with the, are they invited to the table?" Mm-hmm. You know, it's like, "Well, are they aligned with this?
'Cause- Yeah ... this is what our, this is our center." This is, yeah, this is the bottom line. Correct. This is what holds us together. And it's not to say that if, um, if you struggle with people who maybe don't agree with you on some of those more s- I guess you could call- Mm-hmm ... secondary matters, that you're not invited to the space, or that you're, you know, you're not allowed- Mm-hmm
in or anything. It's like we would, we would say that, um, you know, we're, we're all kind of moving towards this, like, it's almost kind of more of like a, a, a bounded versus a centered set idea- Mm-hmm ... of going, this is our center and this is what we would say we all unite around. Mm-hmm. And we're gonna all be in a wide array outside.
Yeah. It's not an in or out-
Mike Glenn: This is, this is the center of gravity that holds
Melanie Wise: us all in our orbit. Yes. The center of gravity. Yeah. That is a perfect ph- I'm gonna use that going forward. Yeah. That's helpful. So it's just been really helpful in providing that clarity for people about who do we engage with and who do we not.
Yeah. Yeah. And so, yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: That's good stuff. Yeah. So what keeps you up at night?[00:41:00]
Melanie Wise: Right now, two children. Um, if you wanna be quite honest, um-
Mike Glenn: And you said they're five-year-old and seven-year-old ... uh, five
Melanie Wise: and seven. I'll be honest. Yeah. Only one of them still sometimes keeps us up at night, but- No, no ... um, no
Mike Glenn: Oh, wait till he's a teenager
Melanie Wise: driving. Oh, my word, yes, yes. Then you never sleep. The days are coming.
Mike Glenn: You do not sleep at all when they're driving.
Melanie Wise: Can't wait. It just never goes away. Yeah. Awesome. Um, yeah. I, I think, um, goodness, there's so many things that come to mind, but I think that the exhaustion and overwhelm and burnout of leaders in the faith community is something that the Lord has given me a very specific burden for.
Mm-hmm. And I now am seeing that disunity is a huge reason that that's happening. Mm-hmm. Disconnection, loneliness, [00:42:00] overwhelm. It's like I've always kind of carried this, just w- this, just honestly, like, just grief over the fact that there are these men and women who have, who have come forward and said like, "Lord, I wanna lead.
I wanna step into these places." And with a passion and a desire to make a difference in the world, and it's just like over time they just get more and more worn down- Mm ... and worn out, and they burn out, and they leave, and-
Mike Glenn: That's what they end up doing isn't what they signed up for.
Melanie Wise: Absolutely not.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Melanie Wise: Absolutely not. That's not what I signed up for. And I see that when I see young, um, you know, people are, like these, these, these, these young men and women who are coming out of college, and they're just like so excited- Yeah, and they're trained well ... and I'm like, "Oh, it's gonna eat you alive," you know? Yeah, that's right.
Yeah. And I just go, man, I think the, the system, for lack of a better word, feels broken, and I think it's, I think it's producing the very results it was, it's designed to produce. Yeah. It's worn out and exhausted- Yeah ... and overwhelmed leaders- They're worn out ... that, that are man, like the fire that was there that started this is not there.
Mm-hmm. You know?
Mike Glenn: And they're- And the damage it not only does [00:43:00] to the leader but to the leader's family.
Melanie Wise: Yes. Yes. You know? It's,
Mike Glenn: it- And the, the number of children who are PKs- Mm ... and MKs who-
Melanie Wise: Absolutely ... who really struggle with their faith Like I'm not here for that. Absolutely. The, the hurt, the woundedness, and at best, just the utter, just I'm burnt.
Yeah. I can't do it anymore. That's right. So that has, that has laid heavy on me for so long, for many, many years, and I'm, and I'm now starting to make this connection of going, oh, like I think the... Again, I don't know a better word to use, but the system feels broken. Mm-hmm. And there's something about this idea of the body of Christ starting to align more with how God architected His church to, to function- Mm-hmm
as a body, like truly as a- Mm-hmm ... unified body, that I think might be part of the key to like unlock a new way- Mm-hmm ... that is like life-giving and encouraging. Not only is it like a strategically [00:44:00] good decision to collaborate and work alongside one another, because you're gonna do more together than you can ever do apart.
So yeah, like makes sense logically- Mm-hmm ... but I also think there's something about just the, the spiritual transformation that can happen within the body of Christ when, when we start to operate as one. Right. We really actually function as one. That, I hope and pray, revives the leaders around our city and beyond, and certainly- As we bring up a new generation of leaders, that they're like, "Oh, uh, we're bringing in them into something that is healthy and life-giving and encouraging."
Like, that would be, that's the vision.
Mike Glenn: So what gets you up early in the morning?
Melanie Wise: Also the children. Uh I'm like, "Interesting you would ask." Oh, goodness. That's... Oh, these are great questions, Pastor Mike. I, I think I have, as I think I've, I've shared, I have more hope than I ever have before That I, well, I have, [00:45:00] um, more awareness than I ever have before of what God is doing in the city of Nashville.
Mm. Now, and I can say the city of Nashville, but as we're connected with cities around the country- Right ... that are doing this work, and I'm on calls with them all the time. We're in text threads- Mm ... just encouraging one another, hearing what's happening around the country, and I'm like, "Oh, my word."
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
That's the, that's the, oh, Elijah prayer. Yeah. "I'm the last one," and God says, "Be... I, I got 800 over here- Right ... to the side, so- Yes ... so don't think you're the last one on the front." No,
Melanie Wise: that's so
Mike Glenn: good. That's so good. Sometimes you... If we don't see it happening in our little playground, then we think, "Well, God has abandoned us."
Well,
Melanie Wise: right.
Mike Glenn: No, He's over here working. He's
Melanie Wise: fine. Absolutely. So. And I think that, honestly, that community has been, like, lifeblood for me- Mm-hmm ... 'cause on the days where I'm like-
Mike Glenn: Yeah ... "
Melanie Wise: What are we doing?" Yeah. I get a story from someone, you know, in the Chicago area or in DFW- Right ... that's like, "Guess what just happened in our city today?"
Mm. And I'm like, "Oh, okay, okay, okay. I can do this- Yeah ... another day." Yeah. But more than anything, um, I think knowing that, that the Lord is at work in our [00:46:00] city and is stirring hearts and, and is drawing people together, and quite frankly, I think a lot of people are just tired of- Mm ... and they're just hungry for something different- Mm
and a new way to move forward together, and that has m- I just have so much hope, truly, for what the Lord is doing in our city, that I'm just like, "I can't believe I get to be part- Yeah ... of this." That's right, yeah. And so just may I be faithful with whatever you have asked us to do- Mm-hmm ... in this space because I am aware of something much, much bigger that's happening in our city and beyond.
But man, that is a crazy fun thing to get to be part of. Isn't it? Isn't it? Yes. Yeah, that's a
Mike Glenn: blast.
Melanie Wise: Yeah. Yes.
Mike Glenn: So if I wanna find out more about, uh, Together Nashville, where do I go?
Melanie Wise: Yes. We... Listen, we just launched a, launched some s- things on social media recently. I was like, "I think you gotta do it." Step forward.
You know, you gotta be you gotta be- Yeah ... on the social media somewhere. I've had, I've had some, I've had some pastors say, "I don't wanna be on social media."
Mike Glenn: I say, "Well, that's tough 'cause your people are there." They are. I- Yeah. That is so true ... If you wanna talk to your people, you better be on social media.
Melanie Wise: I- [00:47:00] it's true. And also, let's, let's be honest. Let's put some, like, good, encouraging, redemptive things- Yeah ... on, on social media. Yeah. So we just started there. You can find us on social media, on Instagram and on Facebook. Um, you can also go to together nashville.org, where we've got just information- Oh, yeah
on who we are- Mm-hmm ... and what we're about. Um, and, and really, at the end of the day, I mean, my absolute favorite thing that I've gotten to do over this last year and a half is just to get to sit across the table from people in this city- Mm-hmm ... and to hear what God is doing through their ministries or their churches, hear what God's putting on their heart, vision that they have.
And so, man, I, I... It has been way more fun than I could've imagined- Yeah ... getting to do that. And so I just would love any opportunity to get to sit across the table from someone and hear their story and hear what God is doing and, and what it looks like to engage together. So, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: She's Melanie Wise.
Her organization is To- Together Nashville.
Melanie Wise: That's right.
Mike Glenn: And so get on together nashville.org and find a way that you can get connected and to all that's going [00:48:00] on-
Melanie Wise: Mm ...
Mike Glenn: in the great city of Nashville. Thanks for being with us today,
Melanie Wise: Melanie. Thank you so much. This has been fun. Yeah. Appreciate it.
