Reaching Middle Tennessee: What Churches Must Understand About the Growth Explosion
As Middle Tennessee transforms with explosive population growth and shifting demographics, what does that mean for the future of the church? Join Mike and special guest Lewis McMullen from the Tennessee Baptist Mission Board as they unpack how migration trends, cultural shifts, and local community dynamics are reshaping ministry in the region. From the surprising role of small towns like Fayetteville to the changing face of East Nashville, this episode is packed with insight on how churches must adapt — or risk fading into irrelevance.
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Mike Glenn: Hi, I'm Mike Glenn. I am the president and founder of the Engaged Church Network. Joining us today on our podcast is my friend Lewis McMullen. I've known Lewis for a lot of years, and he's done a lot of work with me in demographics and church planting and what n- is needed where. He works with the Tennessee Baptist Mission Board.
He is an old farm boy from Florida and, uh, has now become one of the big computer geeks in my life. And, uh, knows all the changes about demographics, and that's what we're gonna talk with him about today. Welcome- Thank you ... uh, to Lewis. Glad you are here, man. Thank you. So. [00:01:00] Glad to be here. So you and I have talked a lot about the changing demographics of, of, uh, of Middle Tennessee.
Lewis McMullen: Yes.
Mike Glenn: The Nashville and the surrounding area. Mm-hmm. About how the growth of Huntsville is impacting the growth of and the population of Southern Tennessee. Right. And how the growth of Fort Campbell and all of that is affecting Clarksville and all the northern counties there. So, uh, just kind of give us an, an overview real quick of how, uh, the demographics are changing in numbers and makeup, and then we'll talk about the difference that makes to churches.
Lewis McMullen: Okay. I- if we're thinking Middle Tennessee, we're thinking from Fort Campbell on th- the west. Mm-hmm. And I'm gonna say over to Cookeville. On the east Okay. All right ... because i- i- it's starting to incorporate- Mm-hmm ... through there. Or, or Lebanon and Cookeville, going down to the Alabama line from Kentucky- Right
[00:02:00] line. And you're looking, you know, Huntsville, all of a sudden Fayetteville is now this- Right ... growing city that used to be a small town. Um, what we're seeing is, especially in the next six years, we're looking at anywhere from an 8 to 9% increase in population- Ooh ... just in that Middle Tennessee area. But here's what's happening, though, is Nashville proper is almost built itself out.
Mm-hmm. So everybody's pushing out, where they can still drive in the Nashville proper, still work in Nashville proper, but, you know, uh, six years ago when I... Well, actually, 11 years ago when I started on convention staff-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Lewis McMullen: I was told everything was gonna stop at 840. Right. It, it did. It, it, it's like a bathtub.
Yeah. It has overfilled. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Well, well, when I started in 1991 at Brentwood, Franklin was [00:03:00] way out of town. Yes, it is. And people in Franklin would talk about, "I don't wanna drive all the way into Nashville."
Lewis McMullen: Mm-hmm. Well, now Columbia, Lewisburg, um, Chapel Hill, Eagleville, are now the Franklins of those days.
Where they
Mike Glenn: were, where Franklin was in '91 is where these communities are now. Where they are
Lewis McMullen: now, but it's not gonna be long because- Wow ... it, it's picking up. And one of the, the growth corridors I'm seeing is from Eagleville to Murfreesboro- Right ... along that road- Yeah, the west side of Na- ... it's just exploding
yeah, yeah. And people are saying, "Well, who's coming in?" Well, we are seeing, uh, I'll start with the nor- the, the obvious, California.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: But we're seeing Illinois. We are seeing Floridians.
Mike Glenn: That's always befuddled me. Whenever you do the demographics, we have a positive, uh, immigration from Florida. Yes. I don't know, do they go to Florida and say, "This is not what I thought it was gonna [00:04:00] be," and come back
They, uh, well,
Lewis McMullen: Tennessee is the halfway back.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Okay. They go to
Lewis McMullen: Florida. They find, yeah, you know, cost of living's a little high. Uh-huh. Um, you know, a little hectic.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: Um, we've got more, a little bit more breathing space here, a little bit- Right ... lower cost of living, um, better healthcare in some places.
Mm-hmm. So they move back here. And move to Middle Tennessee. They've got the change of seasons. Mm-hmm. They can go still see their friends in Florida- Mm-hmm ... or they can go see, see their friends up north. Family, family
Mike Glenn: back north.
Lewis McMullen: Up north. And the other thing that is happening, we're seeing more and more of our 30s, 20, 30s, and 40s staying here.
You know, um, they're coming here for school, or they're coming here for work. They like it. They like the, the idea of being close to a major city.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: The other thing that really works is, uh, we got s- the 65, [00:05:00] 24, and 40- Mm-hmm ... through here. So you can hop on any interstate- And get, get around about anywhere
and go and
Mike Glenn: engage. So the folks who used to leave for Charlotte, Atlanta, Chicago, New York- Are
Lewis McMullen: staying here ... they're now staying here. They're staying here. Um, the biggest advantage Tennessee has is we, we don't have that state income tax. Right. Uh, we've got a growing healthcare industry that's just booming.
Right. Um, we, you know, a lot of people say, "Well, the music industry." Well, yeah, we do have a music industry, but, uh... And I'm gonna correct something on this podcast. We're n- we're been known as the home of country music. Only 12% of the music produced here in Nashville- Is country ... is country music. That's right.
We've got all kinds. We got everything. So that means everything that relates to coun- the music world- Mm-hmm ... is here.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: Um, we're seeing more and more of, uh, [00:06:00] private businesses coming up. Mm-hmm. Uh, I was just over in a part of, uh, East Nashville, um, which is a very eclectic, almost like- Mm-hmm ... Portland, Oregon- Right, mm-hmm
type Seattle. And, uh, the, I'm seeing all these little small startups from people who've got their college degree, got in business-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Lewis McMullen: and they're making it work
Mike Glenn: here. Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: And though we're seeing all that just kind of pour in- Okay ... with that migration.
Mike Glenn: Okay.
Lewis McMullen: And a lot of this started right when COVID hit.
And when COVID hit, Tennessee became the number one relocation site- Mm-hmm ... for people getting out of where they were going, coming. And they're all on the interstates. And they're all on the interstates. And there were, there are three areas. Okay. Middle Tennessee, Johnson City. City. [00:07:00] Tri-Cities. Up in the mountains.
Up in the mountains. Mm-hmm. And Sevierville, Pigeon Forge, and that area. Gatlinburg. Gatlinburg. And all of that. Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Okay. Now, you mentioned that you were over in East Nashville, and, uh, I- One of the things that we've discovered, uh, y- you know well, is that East Nashville is a very different community than- Mm-hmm
than d- the other parts of Nashville. A church that would work in East Nashville wouldn't work in another part of the city, and a, a church that would work in another part of the city won't work there. Mm. So tell me about what all of this changing demographic means for changing churches.
Lewis McMullen: You are bec- we are becoming more community-oriented again.
Right. We're local community where even in East Nashville, you go three blocks and you're in a different world. Right. It's almost like New York.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: Um, and so as you start [00:08:00] looking at that different neighborhoods is a different ministry flow, a different ministry leadership. Right. Um, and, and, you know, one of the things I do, I work with churches with search committees now, and I'm doing con- analysis of the leadership, the people who are there.
What kind of leadership do they want? Mm-hmm. What kind of ministry do they want? What kind of activities do they want? And what we're finding is in these little communities, each one is different.
Mike Glenn: Right. And it's literally, you me- you mentioned a while ago, you cross the road-
Lewis McMullen: You're in a different world
and
Mike Glenn: you are in a different world. And- This, this area is rural. That area is suburban. This-
Lewis McMullen: And your leadership style might not cross the road. That's right. Your ministry style might not cross the road. Mm-hmm. And what it is is people are, who are like-minded, like-thought, like-rhythms of life- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm
are gathering together. Mm-hmm. You know, it's, they're doing it on their own. [00:09:00] Um, and so you-
Mike Glenn: And this not, this is not about race. No. I mean, uh, it- It's- ... it- it's about common, uh, interest, common jobs. It's lifestyle So lifestyles,
Lewis McMullen: uh, and- Very much so. Yeah. And, and one thing that people don't understand, y- you might look alike.
Mm-hmm. You might sound alike. Be different. And but- Yeah ... uh, your, your, your leadership reactions, your ministry are gonna be totally different. Mm-hmm. Um, you know, I've, I've told people I'm, I'm 62. I don't think I could pastor a church in East Nashville because I don't fit the profile- Right ... of, of the people there anymore.
Mm-hmm. I understand it as a guy who does demographic research, who, missiology and- Mm-hmm ... those type of things, but it's just not who I am. Right. And I think that's one thing that churches need to look at and [00:10:00] church leaders need to look at. That if people aren't coming to your church, it's not necessarily you're bad, you just don't fit no more.
Mike Glenn: Well, that, yeah, that's the thing. Baskin-Robbins has 31 flavors of ice cream for a reason.
Lewis McMullen: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And you have to decide what flavor your community is, and can you as a church match that flavor? Well, I'll tell you
Lewis McMullen: one st- uh, is it ice cream or are you gonna be custard? Yeah. Is it, um- Yogurt or- Yogurt. Is it, is it coffee?
Is it espresso? What, and-
Mike Glenn: What is that? The, the, uh, uh, the paradox of choice. Yes. Where we actually have so many choices now in every part of our life, and church- for church it's the same way. Yeah. Yeah.
Lewis McMullen: And, you know, we had that old, uh, Mike, you probably remember the old worship wars. Yeah. Um, you know, everybody said, "Well, if we did this type of worship we'd..."
Mm-hmm. That, that's- Over ... out the door now. Over. It's [00:11:00] very much over. It is, who is in your context? What are their thought processes? What are their interests? W- how do they work? How they react. Mm-hmm. Your leadership, your ministry, your ministry styles. Even your personnel, if you're getting- They're new ... them for your church has to fit that context.
Right.
Mike Glenn: And you know, this is the kind of discussion we used to have, Lewis, around missionaries. Okay? Well, you gotta be a
Lewis McMullen: missionary to that. Yeah, right.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, okay. That, that's, that's my point. It used to be w- does this person have the personality to adapt to this culture change- Mm-hmm ... to fit in with this culture change?
Is there anything about you as a person or your story that will be offensive, uh, to the culture where we're trying to send you? This was, uh, what, what... You know, my point is this is not anything new. No, but it's now come home. Uh, the context where we're applying this is very new. Mm. But we've been doing this for [00:12:00] generations on the mission field.
Now we are the mission field. And
Lewis McMullen: we're slow to adapt. Yes. Um, you know, we're, we're slow to adapt. Churches don't, uh, churches that look for leadership don't look at it like, well, we're trying to find a leader who fits us.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: Is it a leader who fits us? Or that fits the context. Or a leader, the context, and can help lead that group to minister to that context.
Mm-hmm. That's where I come in sometimes with new churches and say, "You know, you don't fit this context. And there's nothing wrong with you. There are still people in this context you can reach. But instead of either, one, destroying your church 'cause you're trying to fit- Right Let's start something new that fits this context with a leader- Mm-hmm
who can adapt- Mm ... understand, and reach to that.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Stores do this all the time. They'll have three [00:13:00] levels of store. Mm-hmm. They'll have this level where you can get this kind of product at this price point. You'll have ano- you know, Dollar General, which is located here in the national headquarters.
They've got Dollar General, they've got, uh, all of these other different kinds of Dollar General stores to fit different context. Yeah. And each one of them is different. E- and each one of them is successful. And the ... But if you take one store and put it in another place, it may not work.
Lewis McMullen: Um- Well, even today with the, the context of people moving in, you know, you got Lowe's and you got Home Depot.
Right. But majority of people who live here now go to the local hardware store now.
Mike Glenn: Ah, don't like the
Lewis McMullen: big box store anymore. They don't like the big box. They want the personal connection, talk to somebody. That's where we also have to look at church. Ah. Who do I connect with? And that, that's the other ... If you don't have anyone in that context that they've [00:14:00] connected, that are like the ones they connected with in the community, they're not gonna come.
They're not gonna connect with you.
Mike Glenn: There's nobody like me there. Yeah. I don't see me when I, when I go there. And- I don't see me on the platform.
Lewis McMullen: I s- I, I experience that when I preach in some churches. You know, I- Mm-hmm ... I'm a friendly guy, I'm an outgoing guy. Yeah. I get along with people, I talk with people.
But I'll look around the room and go, "I'm the odd man out here." And- You're an
Mike Glenn: extrovert and- I'm, I'm an extrovert ... and
Lewis McMullen: nobody else is. And even some people, you, you walk in, you've been out in the community, you walk in. I just did a 20-year time warp
Mike Glenn: backwards. Yeah, yeah.
Lewis McMullen: And I don't fit and understand this.
And not only do you not fit, you're suspicious. You're, you're very suspicious. Yeah. And they're suspicious of you- Mm-hmm ... because you don't look like them. Yeah, that's right. You talk- They sus- yeah. And what's happened is, you know, we've, we've got all these new outside influences, these people moving in, [00:15:00] bringing in their, their culture, bringing in their, their rhythms, bringing in their, their, their taste and dislikes and likes- Mm-hmm
and politics. You know, uh, don't- Yeah ... don't get me started on that. You know, um, they're looking for a place that feels safe. Mm-hmm. A place that they're not, people are not suspicious, and a place, um, where people can connect. We might not 100% agree with one another- Mm-hmm ... but you're not gonna stand there and look down your nose at me or point your finger.
Mm-hmm. That's where our churches have struggle with the connecting with people because, you know, uh, Well, we want them to come in and be like us. Right. And we can't. They just don't fit anymore.
Mike Glenn: Um- They don't fit that profile. They
Lewis McMullen: don't fit. And the other thing is, you know, there, there's kind of an individual expressism with people migrating- Mm-hmm
Mike Glenn: in.
Lewis McMullen: Mm-hmm. [00:16:00] Um, they have their little, it, it, you know, they, they have their ways that they express themselves. They like to be individualistic. And sometimes churches struggle with that. We want everybody to fit the routine- Mm ... fit the mold. But, you know, I, I'm gonna get scriptural here. You have Mike, I know scripture a little bit.
Um- Oh, no ... um, it says, "Eyes not the eye, the eye is not the ear." Mm-hmm. "The foot is not the..." So when I look at the people coming in with, from these different cultures and everything, I look at it like, all right, if the Lord wants them to be part of the body-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ... we gotta set- Why is he bringing them here?
Yeah. You know, I- That difference ... we have talked with a couple other pastor friends of mine. The number of talented people that are moving into the Middle Tennessee area, we, I mean, I've started talking about it as a marshaling of forces. There's something that God is up to, just from all the people that, that he's bringing in here.
Okay, we got a room full of [00:17:00] pastors here, Lewis. What do you want to tell them about the opportunities and challenges that we're now facing in, in, in the Middle Tennessee area? Change
Lewis McMullen: your mindset. You're n- you, you, yes, you are a pastor, but you gotta think like a missionary. That's right.
Mike Glenn: You're no longer a chaplain of the status quo.
Lewis McMullen: You're no longer a chaplain. Mm-hmm. If you wanna be a chaplain of the status quo, um, you're probably gonna die. The church is gonna die. You need to think missionary. You also need to think, all right, if our church is going to transition, we don't want it to die. We want it to be legacy. There's several ways to do that.
Right. But the, the thing that you need to do is, all right, I need to bring someone on my staff who fits this- This context ... context. What I do is I mentor him everything I know about-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Lewis McMullen: pastoring.
Mike Glenn: Every Paul makes a Timothy.
Lewis McMullen: Every Paul makes a Timothy. You make him a Timothy, give him the pastoring [00:18:00] skills, but give him the freedom to be the missionary who starts connecting.
Ah, key point. Key
Mike Glenn: point. Freedom. Give him the skills. Mm-hmm. Teach him the things that can be taught, but then give him the freedom to adapt that to the context. Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: And the freedom to bring people in that will fit that. Right. Pastors can set that- lead with their people. Mm-hmm. They can also take what I call some of the heat from those people.
Right. When, you know, uh, "I've seen every change and I've been against it all." That's right. You know, I, I, I hear that a lot. That's the only way survival's gonna happen. Right. Mm-hmm. Because it, it's not gonna reverse. We're not gonna get a influx of people who won't, "I want 1920s, 1930s, 1940s church." That's right, yeah, yeah.
It, it's just over with.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: If that doesn't happen, you can tell that maybe [00:19:00] three or four years, maybe five years with the, the changes that keep happening. Mm-hmm. We're gonna be having more conversations with churches- That are closing ... we're down to, we're down to 20. We can't pay the bills anymore.
Right. Nobody cares about us, and we're either gonna have to restart this thing or, um, just close it down and sell it. Well,
Mike Glenn: well I know that's not f- true that nobody cares. Obviously we at the Engage Church Network care. Mm-hmm. You, Lewis McMullen care personally, and, uh, the, you, our friends at the Tennessee Baptist Mission Board, Randy Davis and all that, uh, care, care a, a, a great deal.
What's the thing that, that excites you? Now, now I know there's lots of challenges, but I also know there, there's times when you see something that almost makes you laugh out loud with excitement.
Lewis McMullen: I'm seeing an, an uptick of young pastors who have seen, hey, we do need to change.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: Um, and when I say young, [00:20:00] younger than me.
Um, most of our planters now are in their 30s, 30s and 40s- Yeah, it's, it's- ... that are coming in ...
Mike Glenn: it's not a first church planter anymore. It's a second or third- They're- ... that are planting now ... they're-
Lewis McMullen: Interesting ...
Mike Glenn: or they pastored a church. Yeah. They've pastored a church, now the second church is gonna be a church planting not- Mm-hmm
not moving up the, the corporate ladder that used to be there when, when you and I started. Right, and
Lewis McMullen: they're seeing we gotta do something different. Mm-hmm. I'm excited about that. You, you know, I don't feel like I'm charging the hill yelling and screaming- Right ... and look behind me and there's nobody.
There, there's other guys that are doing it. That excites me. I also see, um, I've been in some meetings the last few weeks of some established church pastors saying, "You know, my church can't change."
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: You know, uh, we've, we're ingrained, but we wanna help see new churches get started- Yeah ... that can change.
Mike Glenn: And, and those churches are very generous to starting other churches. Mm-hmm. Okay, we're not gonna be the church that does [00:21:00] this. We'll help get that church started We'll help get it Mm-hmm
Lewis McMullen: And what I'm finding is, and, and I'm getting excited. They're starting to come to me and say, "How do we do this?" Yeah Now here's the other thing that, um, that I've been excited about is I'm seeing more and more replants- Mm-hmm
take place. Mm-hmm And we're not fighting the hard battle of trying to convince a church, um, "Hey, you're not gonna make it." Right They're, they're coming to us now. Right Um, because used to the conversation would- Oh, yeah ... take two
Mike Glenn: years. Mm-hmm. And we used to have conversations about waiting for the church to get sick enough-
Lewis McMullen: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Well- ... before they would change ...
Lewis McMullen: sometimes it's not sick enough anymore. It's, well, that's what- It's two or three mechanical- Yeah. ... disasters away. Yeah. Just the boiler. Um, you know, I'm d- I'm dealing with two situations right now where, um, the church came to an, uh, to the local Baptist association, said, "We know we're not gonna make it.
[00:22:00] Help us." And some champion churches have stepped up- Stepped, yeah ... and said, "We're g- we've got guys on our staff that can do this- Do this ... that we've been mentoring." Mentoring, yeah And so I'm working in those situations and just kind of seeing, hey, we're not losing ground. Somebody says, "Well, uh, but you're closing down a church."
Yeah, but we're replacing it with something new. You know, I, th- m- I grew up in the country. You know, somebody dies somewhere, there's a new baby born somewhere. Right. Yeah, yeah
Mike Glenn: And,
Lewis McMullen: well, if we're staying even, that's better. Right now we're not staying even. I mean- How many churches do we need to start? A year?
Mm-hmm Just to keep up with population is 52 a year. Middle Tennessee, 47, uh, of that- Wow ... just to keep up. If we wanted to exceed, 75 to 100 a [00:23:00] year. So one to two a week. One to two a week. And I don't have, I don't have enough church planters, replanters in the hopper. Yeah Um, you know, we used to... I, I, I tell people I did church planting before it was sexy.
Um, used to we had a influx of guys who wanted to go into church planting. Mm-hmm What we did, we, we did some of it right, we did some of it wrong. We, um, and I think where we did it wrong was we had some guys who were excited. We sent them out with a, "God bless you. Here's a check." That's right. Right Uh, "Here's a book.
Hope you make it." Right And we burned a lot of guys up. But what we have also done is we've not really shown a lot of healthy models of church planting- Mm-hmm ... where guys have seen it. Or the guys who are wanting to plant today- [00:24:00] Are struggling with, I, but I wanna make 50 and 60 and 70 and 80,000 in my new church plant.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Lewis McMullen: Well, the day of one church doing a church plant like that is very rare because- Right ... I could probably count on one hand right now churches in Nashville that could do a church plant by themselves.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: So we're, we're kinda s- tell them, "You've gotta be entrepreneurial."
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: You've gotta be tent maker like Paul.
That's right. That's right. You may be a co-pastor, a
Mike Glenn: co-vocational pastor for a while.
Lewis McMullen: And you need to have the guy who's gonna plant your next church going with you. Mm-hmm. Um, which is, you know, I did that when I lived in Arizona. I had that guy, had that Timothy with me and- Mm-hmm ... and so we, we've not done that.
And I think one of the reasons that I think we have a shortage of even planters or pastors or replanters- Mm-hmm ... somehow [00:25:00] we have quit giving the call to ministry in our churches to say, "Hey, maybe God's calling you to- Right ... to minister." I think we've, we've lost that. Mm-hmm. You know, um, I remember when you were at Brentwood, you had a, a slew of guys- Yeah, mm-hmm
in the, in the, I call it the bullpen. That's right. Right? That's- Mm-hmm. We don't have a lot of that anymore, and that's, that's the one thing that really depresses me. Um- That's right ... I'll, I'll have people call, "Hey, we wanna plant a church. You got me a planter?" I said, "Yeah, let me go in my backyard- ... pull the guy off the tree-
put a little water on him." Yeah,
Mike Glenn: yeah. And he'll- Well, one of the new emphasis on, uh, that you'll hearing, be hearing about soon is, uh, the, the, a, the leadership institute to train- Mm-hmm ... identify and train these, these pastors under the umbrella of, uh, of a pastor who- Yes ... will be supporting your s- supporting your work.
How do people reach you?
Lewis McMullen: Uh, easiest way is text my phone number. Okay. [00:26:00] 615-815-5095. Uh, I do church planting. Uh, well, my title is now Multiplying Healthy Churches Team Leader. Uh, don't have it on my business card yet, 'cause I don't wanna have to continue to- I was gonna say, you went to flap- Yeah ... you have to flap that thing out here.
Um, and so I work with church planting and replanting. But the other thing I do a lot for the convention and for churches and, you know, if they wanna reach out to me and say, "Hey, could you do a community analysis for
Mike Glenn: us?" Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: Um, we will do that. I do a, a lot of that with, um, things. And the way, the way I look at it is if you're gonna do ministry in a community, if you're gonna do ministry in Middle Tennessee, um, you gotta approach it like war.
E- exactly, yeah. You've gotta know who your enemy is, do all the reconnaissance, and know your best technique to, to attack it. And, and that- Because that
Mike Glenn: is different in every, every context.
Lewis McMullen: Mm-hmm. And if you, if you [00:27:00] go in with the same game plan, you, you're not gonna, you're not gonna succeed. Mm-mm. And, um, uh, I think maybe that's one thing, you know, as you were talking about leadership.
We need to get pastors and leaders to think strategically
Mike Glenn: now. Mm-hmm.
Lewis McMullen: It's, you- you've gotta think strategic about your community. Mm-hmm. You gotta think strategic about your leadership.
Mike Glenn: Um- Well, wow, you put a whole list of new demands. You, you made the pastor an entrepreneur. You've made him a missionary.
You've made him a strategist now. Mm-hmm. And, uh, so it's just not the three points and the poem on Sunday anymore, huh? Mm-mm.
Lewis McMullen: Minist- you know, pastoring now is almost needs to be a science.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, yeah. And- There's a lot of ... The same data that everybody else is using is available for us- Mm-hmm ... uh, to put before the Lord and, and, and see how it would impact the, the way that we do church.[00:28:00]
Lewis, thanks for being- Thank you ... with us today. And we're gonna have you back, 'cause this, this, this change isn't, isn't- ... stopping. And so we'll have some- There's not your- ... more. This is Lewis, uh, uh, McMullen. He works for the Tennessee Baptist Mission Board and, uh, in the area of church planting and demographics and all that.
He is a great friend and great resource. I can testify to that, uh, on a, on a very personal level. I'm Mike Glenn, and this has been the Engage Church Network. Thanks for joining us.
Thanks for tuning in to the Engage Church Network podcast. We exist to train healthy and skilled leaders for congregations throughout Middle Tennessee. If today's episode helped you, share it with a fellow leader, and don't forget to visit engagechurchnetwork.com for more ways to grow.
