Cole Huffman Talks Church Startups & Stability
In this powerful conversation, a Nashville pastor shares a hard-won journey of calling, healing, and hope. After leading through the 2019–2020 crucible-personal family strain, ministry stress, and a season where every decision drew critique-he stepped away without a next role and spent a year letting God rebuild his soul. He opens up about that healing year and the surprising door God then opened to The Gospel Church in Nashville.
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Mike Glenn: What we say around here is that the first reformation gave the Bible back to the people. Mm-hmm. The second reformation that we're in now is giving ministry-
Cole Huffman: Yeah ...
Mike Glenn: back to the people.
Cole Huffman: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Now, one of the things that we do, uh, uh, in this discussion, uh- Mm-hmm ... Cole, is to, uh, talk about, uh, the r- the variety of churches in Middle Tennessee- Yeah ... and the s- different styles. I have this theory that there's a reason Baskin-Robbins has 31 flavors of ice cream. Mm-hmm. And that everybody likes the same flavor, and not everybody.
So, uh, you are ... You followed a very good friend of ours. Yeah. He's a good friend of mine. I don't know- Oh, yeah, yeah ... if
Cole Huffman: you [00:01:00] would- Mike's
Mike Glenn: been great to me. Yeah ... if you would claim Artur to be- Yeah ... to be your friend I got to know his dad
Cole Huffman: real
Mike Glenn: well. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: Okay. Yeah. His dad and I still chat. Yeah. And I ... And I
Mike and I text every three or four months.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Yeah. And so- Yeah ... when I met Mike, he was, uh, The Gospel Church was being planted-
Cole Huffman: Mm-hmm ...
Mike Glenn: uh, kinda thing. And then- He came out of Memphis ... he came out of our- Mm. I had forgotten that connection. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Out of the
Cole Huffman: church around the corner from me. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: So he came, did that.
Came to work on, uh, on, on our staff at Brentwood for a while, and then from there, went to where he is now, at First Baptist- Mm-hmm ... Spartanburg. So what was it that attracted you to The Gospel Church? And, and, and tell us- Well, I needed a job. That's right. Employment. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: When I left, uh, my old, my former church, I didn't have a place to go.
Mike Glenn: Mm.
Cole Huffman: Which, you know, there's a story in that. Um, you know, when you leave and nowhere to go, it's kind of a protest.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: And I was [00:02:00] under the greatest stress I'd ever known- Mm ... in church life. My oldest son was still having a bout with drugs and alcohol, so that had taken a lot of our emotional- Right ... margin.
Church was great to me in that. But we hit, in 2019, a, um, challenge of, uh ... We had a Mother's Day Out crisis, which we, we handled well. Um, but it still, you know, people lose confidence.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: When some- when somebody associated with it gets accused of, or one of our employees got accused of, there was no way to know whether that had happened or not.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And then, you know, 2020 comes in. Hold my beer. Yeah, COVID, right. Yeah. Uh, we've got COVID, racial reconciliation, uh, rec- racial reckoning in a city like Memphis. And so you just found people were ... I just- Suddenly began to, uh, I was put in a series of double bonds. Right. No matter what I did, there was gonna be [00:03:00] critique- Fallout.
Mm-hmm ... and fallout, and I think I was just in a place where, um, I just no longer had the emotional margin to, to take it. Mm-hmm. Looking back and subsequent, you know, a lot of great, uh, healing since then, but at the time, I think what I didn't realize is that 90% of the church was thankful I was there- Mm-hmm
and supportive. There was just a 10%, uh, vocal-
Mike Glenn: They can be loud.
Cole Huffman: They were loud. They
Mike Glenn: can be loud.
Cole Huffman: And they just made trouble, and-
Mike Glenn: Yeah ...
Cole Huffman: and so we got discouraged. And so I left, and I didn't assume that I'd just bop into something else. Mm-hmm. But it took a year. And so, um, when the gospel church put a shingle out, I answered and knew somebody who knew the church but thought, "Well, I'm middle-aged."
Mm-hmm. "They're young. Um, I don't think they're gonna be interested." But one discussion led [00:04:00] into another. I actually tried to get them to hire their young
Mike Glenn: interim-
Cole Huffman: Mm-hmm ... at the time. Um, and they called me back a week later and said, "Would you have another conversation with us?" So I took it that the Lord was- Yeah
opening the door. Let, let's go
Mike Glenn: back to that year you had between- Mm-hmm ... ministries.
Cole Huffman: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Um, I would see that, uh, and, and maybe you would, as, as, as some kind of a failure.
Cole Huffman: Oh, yeah.
Mike Glenn: You know? Okay. You have to fend off that idea. I was, I was, I was left alone for a year. Yeah. I didn't have a job, all that kind of stuff.
In retrospect, how important was that year for your healing? Could, could, could- I think it, I think it was ... could you have gone from what you had just gone through- ... to another position without that year to catch your breath and heal?
Cole Huffman: I, I think I needed the year.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Yeah. [00:05:00] Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And interestingly enough, and I don't necessarily
This can sound like I'm, um, putting more stock in this than I do. It was a year to the day and the very hour- Yeah ... that I had resigned- Wow. Thank you, Lord ... and had my final time- Mm ... at my old church that the new church came
Mike Glenn: calling. Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And so it, it, it almost felt like the Lord saying through that, "I've given you a year.
You're gonna, you're gonna use the year."
Mike Glenn: Yeah. But it was tough because- Well, I think a lot of us don't pay attention to the time that we need to heal.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Oh, yeah. You, you don't, you don't get over this. Well, pastors just tend to put our head down- Yeah. That's right. Yeah ... and do the next thing- Right
and think- And, and- ... it'll get better, it'll get better ... and it festers- Yeah ... and, and it, then it really gets sideways down the road.
Cole Huffman: And I got some therapy and, um, I've got a, a very, um- I had a good therapist, and my wife is wonderfully supportive, and, and I've got good friends. And so [00:06:00] it- it's certainly ... The things that God uses to deepen your prayer life- Mm-hmm
and pull you nearer, I think that happened in that time too. Yeah,
Mike Glenn: yeah. So you end up at Gospel Church. Mm-hmm. And as, as you said, you, you don't seemingly fit the profile.
Cole Huffman: Right.
Mike Glenn: Uh, the Gospel Church is aimed at the young- Mm-hmm ... professionals in the Green Hills Nashville area.
Cole Huffman: Yeah, kinda the west end. Yeah, yeah.
Southern Park. Yeah. Yeah. Area. We draw from other places, but yeah. That's where it sits. Uh,
Mike Glenn: you are, uh, as, as I am, a more seasoned - That's right. Well,
Cole Huffman: you- I like to tell people, uh, I, I'm not in the sunset of my days, but I have had lunch.
Mike Glenn: That's right, yeah. Yeah. That's right, yeah. You're, you're in a, you're in the afternoon, sure.
Uh- What intrigued you to become pastor of a church like the Gospel Church? They
Cole Huffman: made it evident that they felt like they needed to transition from being in startup mode- Yeah ... even [00:07:00] kinda start over mode-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Cole Huffman: to a more stable, established church. Mm-hmm. Which really just takes building infrastructure.
Right. But I didn't come in as any kinda expert in that. I didn't, I didn't know if I could do that. And so we started with the elders. We had three elders at the time. Uh, one stepped, uh, stepped aside, left us with two. We took six guys in the church that looked like they could lead- Mm-hmm ... and were ready for something.
And, uh, did my elder training that I do in-house- Mm-hmm ... with the elders. We focus on the doctrinal and the moral and the relational component of eldership. And we tapped three of those guys to be elders. Appointed them with the other two and myself to be elders, and then, uh, implemented a rotation system- Mm-hmm
some [00:08:00] kind of a way to, uh, allow some breaks in the service- Mm-hmm ... of eldering. And then after that, we turned to a mission board. installing that. A finance committee. And then back in May, we installed our first deaconent. And so the infrastructure that we needed to build- Mm-hmm ... I think helped the church just get a sense of, all right, these are the tracks we're gonna run on ministry-wise.
We're, we're building this for the purpose of ministry.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: But we're also ... My philosophy of ministry is to try to give it to the people in the church- Mm-hmm ... as much as you can. Capable people with a sense of calling, uh, who give the time. Mm-hmm. And in every respect, I've been very pleased at who has stepped forward- Mm
and been willing to, uh, be called and asked- Yeah ... to serve. What
Mike Glenn: we say around here is that the first reformation gave the Bible back to the people. Mm-hmm. The second reformation that we're in now is giving ministry- [00:09:00]
Cole Huffman: Yeah ...
Mike Glenn: back to the people.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. Yeah, I think, I think, um, I, I've experienced, um, aspects of that.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And so that's been really rewarding and encouraging, and that's been a, a three-year work. So we kinda think in three-year installments. And so we have just started thinking through the next three years. A good
Mike Glenn: biblical number, huh? Yeah.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. Not 40, uh, or seven. We think in three. But I think, um, looking out over the next three years, we're trying to figure out what's
How do we make this fruitful? Mm-hmm. Now, we've done the work of, of the installation of these-
Mike Glenn: Put the skeleton in the body, yeah. That's right.
Cole Huffman: And now how do we make it fruitful? Now how do, how
Mike Glenn: do we make the body move and, and become productive?
Cole Huffman: We've
Mike Glenn: got
Cole Huffman: good mission- Mm-hmm ... good vision, good values, good initiatives.
How do we work those- Mm-hmm ... to where our folks really see that as, all right, this is what it means to, to be in this church.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. What is it that makes the Gospel Church unique?
Cole Huffman: Well, [00:10:00] uh, I don't, I don't know if I think of us as unique.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Um, I, I like the mix of people we have. We don't just have younger people.
Mm-hmm. We've got... And, and I figured this might happen. Middle-aged guy gets there, we get some more middle-aged people. Mm-hmm. But I, I think that we, um,
w- I think, well, here's a uniqueness as I think about your question. I, I don't, I don't know of another church our size, uh, a smaller church that sees new people every Sunday.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Now, assimilating them in is a, is a whole 'nother- It's a
Mike Glenn: challenge for anybody. Yeah. Um,
Cole Huffman: but still. But we see them every Sunday.
Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And
Cole Huffman: I'm amazed by that. And, um, I don't know what accounts for that fully, you know. Uh- We ask people sometimes, and sometimes they just [00:11:00] say, "Well, we just found you." You know, we didn't really know, so ... Or, "We were passing by the-" Saw it, yeah ... "
Mike Glenn: street corner and
Cole Huffman: we saw it and thought your name said- Mm-hmm
you're probably people that believe the scriptures and- Mm-hmm ... and try to exalt Jesus," and, and we are. So that's been a uniqueness. Mm-hmm. I think the other unique thing, um, and I don't know if it's so unique to me, I, I, I would hope a lot of my pastoral brothers have had the same experiences. I have felt like they've been very responsive to what I've aimed us toward-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm
Cole Huffman: without it feeling like I'm pushing anything or- Mm-hmm ... there was a concern when I came in, voiced by some of the folks in the church that were older, "Well, you're gonna have this young elder crew, and you're just gonna-
Mike Glenn: Yeah, bulldoze them. Yeah. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: That's not who I am.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Not what I wanna do. I want them to be as [00:12:00] owner, uh, as much owners in this as I am.
Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And
Cole Huffman: I think they are. And I've, I've really ... I, I can't affirm my young elders enough. These guys are really, really good elders. And I tell them, I don't tell them enough, I tell them at times, I ought to tell them every time we meet, "You guys don't know how well you're doing." "You, you're doing this work- Yeah
so good." Yeah. "And you're good shepherds, and you're good administrators, and you're good leaders."
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And they do. I mean, they just are, uh ... This is ... I've served with a lot of elders in a lot of different church contexts. Mm-hmm. I've been a church planter, I've been a large church pastor, and now I'm back in a small church.
And these guys, I, I believe, are the finest group of elders as a group I've ever had. That's some strong endorsement there. And I really- Yeah ... really do, uh, [00:13:00] esteem and value these guys. They're great.
Mike Glenn: So what's your hope for Gospel Church? What's your dream?
Cole Huffman: Well, you know, at, at this stage in ministry, when you see a lot of failures- Yeah
and a lot of debris and a lot of flash in the pan- Mm-hmm ... and we're all excited about this guy and his thing
Mike Glenn: and-
Cole Huffman: Mm-hmm ... man, I'd, I'd like to 10 years from now when I'm in my late 60s, 20 years from now when I'm in my late 70s, whether I'm at the Gospel Church or not, see that that church is still True to its mission to make disciples- Mm-hmm
of Jesus who know their loved and sent. Uh, still wants to make much of Jesus, is, um, a place where people can meet the Lord and can be discipled- Mm ... can grow in a relationship with Christ. [00:14:00] That's, I, I, I wanna bless, I, I've realized at this point in my life, um, now being a grandfather and 30-plus years married and kids are grown- Mm-hmm
I wanna bless. And I understand blessing to be a promotion of wellbeing.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And so I'm happy to get out of the way. I'm happy to be behind the scenes. I don't need a spotlight. I don't want, um, I don't want the, the, the folderol. Mm-hmm. Um, I want substance. Mm-hmm. And so that's what I'm focused on.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, you know, uh, y- you're gonna get worse than that.
I might be good. Yeah. As somebody, as somebody who's, uh, a little, a little more towards the sunset than you. Yeah. Yeah, that gets worse. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: Yeah, there's like, you're something to really, you know, whenever it comes time to... I mean, I, I, I, [00:15:00] I don't know why I'm like this. I've, everywhere I've served, I've always thought of my successor-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm
Cole Huffman: and wanting to leave it for him- Yeah ...
Mike Glenn: well. You know, one of my favorite books is, um, is called 10-10-10. Have you read it?
Cole Huffman: No.
Mike Glenn: It's by Suzy, um, oh gosh, who was, who was the f- uh, the famous, uh, CEO of GE, uh, that, uh, it's, it's his... Welch. Welch. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, Suzy- Jack Welch. Yeah, yeah, Suzy- It's his wife? It's his wife.
Okay. His widow. Yeah. She has a book called 10-10-10. Yeah. Take 10 minutes to think about the next 10 months, the next 10 years.
Cole Huffman: Oh, yeah.
Mike Glenn: Okay? And, and what is it that the future self- Yeah ... is gonna look back at you and say, be mad at you about or- Yeah ... be happy you, at you about, you know?
Cole Huffman: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: So in, so in 10 years- Yeah
uh, when you look back on the Gospel Church, what is it... Yeah, that's the same thing you're saying, is that- Yeah ... here, here, here are the [00:16:00] things that I'll be looking for. Yeah. And I wanna do the things now that I have to do, uh, to do that. Yeah,
Cole Huffman: it's a good way of looking at it. I mean, you, you take wisdom wherever you can find it.
Yeah. And that's, uh,
Mike Glenn: that's
Cole Huffman: good. Yeah. I c- I can utilize that.
Mike Glenn: Well, you know- Yeah ... when, uh, when we were working through the transition at Brentwood Baptist Church, and I was getting ready to step aside, I told some friends, 'cause they were asking me about it, and I said, "Listen," I said, "10 years from now, there's gonna be a family come to Brentwood Baptist Church- Mm-hmm
uh, looking for a church home, someone that can minister to their family, the kids, the w- the husband, the wife, and they're counting on me to make the decisions right now-
Cole Huffman: Yeah
Mike Glenn: That will have the church in a place it can handle that family
Cole Huffman: A proactive- Yeah, proactively ... approach. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah,
Mike Glenn: yeah, with that.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. How many years were you at?
Mike Glenn: 32. That's
Cole Huffman: as long as I've been married. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, I get, "Oh, I wasn't even born," but yeah. No, I was- I, I get, I, I get that [00:17:00] a lot.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. Yeah, I've dated Lynn for 35 years. Yeah. Been married to her for 32.
Mike Glenn: Yeah, Jean and I just celebrated 45- Oh,
Cole Huffman: wow ...
Mike Glenn: uh- Yeah ... years of marriage, you know.
Yeah. So we went on a big trip. I told somebody, "You know, your first anniversary is dinner and roses." Mm-hmm. Yeah, the 45th you gotta drop some change. So Yeah. You know, you gotta blow it out on that, so, uh. Yeah. We did Israel on 25th- Yeah ... 25th
Cole Huffman: anniversary. Yeah. Went to Israel.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. So what excites you about being a pastor?
Cole Huffman: Well-
Mike Glenn: Well, you know, let, let, and let me tell you why I ask that. Mm-hmm. We hear all the negative stories- Oh, yeah ... about how badly you're treated. You and I both have that in our past. Yeah. Uh, you know, that, uh, that kind of stuff. Yeah. So why, why did you get back in it?
Cole Huffman: Yeah, 'cause I thought about being a truck driver.
Mike Glenn: Hey, listen, we all do. I did. We all do.
Cole Huffman: Tow truck driver or just an over the road hauler. Yeah, I wanna
Mike Glenn: get in a truck. I don't want anybody to talk to me. I just wanna drive.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. [00:18:00] And you know, I realized I'd, I realized I'd largely be hiding out if I did that. Mm-hmm. You know, it, it's, uh, kinda like a modern-day Jonah- Mm-hmm
purchasing the ticket for Tarsh- uh, Tarshish. I, I think what excites me about being a pastor is, uh, the long obedience in the same direction.
Mike Glenn: Hmm.
Cole Huffman: That you can put one foot in front of another-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Cole Huffman: for a career.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: You can stay at the same objective. The churches may change and the- Mm-hmm ... people you work with, but that sense of getting to a place in life where you can survey and look back, if, if you're allowed that, if-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm
if
Cole Huffman: I don't die in my sleep one night before I get to do it, and savor, not so much my own faithfulness, but how God used [00:19:00] ministry and the pastoral calling-
Mike Glenn: Yeah ...
Cole Huffman: to show in manifold and continual ways His faithfulness to me.
Mike Glenn: Hmm.
Cole Huffman: And that I can get excited about. Yeah. 'Cause I can see it. Yeah. I do see it.
Yeah. I can see it right now. Well, you know, that's what I would tell
Mike Glenn: pe- people would say, "Hey, Mike, I wouldn't have your job." And I would shrug and say, "You don't get to see what I see."
Cole Huffman: Yeah. Yeah Yeah,
Mike Glenn: you know?
Cole Huffman: I mean, it is an odd vocation. It is. And it's, it's, um, it, it's an odd calling. And yet, um, I don't
The things that I value the most about the Lord, I don't know that I'd have learned or gotten without being a pastor.
Mike Glenn: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Agreed.
Cole Huffman: Yeah. I mean, I, I, I wouldn't have to preach another sermon. I could still do the work.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: I ... What I like more now, I'm ... God's faithfulness to me in giving me a sermon [00:20:00] every week- Mm-hmm
and I'm still preaching 40 times plus a year. So every week there's that faithful-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Cole Huffman: provision of ... I love the early morning on Sundays at the church by myself walking in the sanctuary and thanking God for I got another sermon.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: You've provided ... and because I polish them.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. But I, I, I would do- Yeah, and, and- Yeah
and remembering the week before, you walked out exhausted- Yeah ... not having a clear thought in your head. And still. I've
Cole Huffman: been doing this for 30 plus years. Yeah. And still looking at a text and going, "What, what am I gonna say about this?"
Mike Glenn: Yeah. You know? That, that, a- that 500 other guys haven't already said.
Yeah. Yeah. Like a sense
Cole Huffman: of bewilderment on the front- Yeah ... knowing that He's always given me a sermon. That's right. It's like how many times does He have to do this? That's right. Before ... But I think that ... I mean, I, I almost think that beginning sort of i- it's ... It just keeps you [00:21:00] humble. Mm-hmm. It keeps you realizing that you're a receptor.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. And I don't have- Yeah, you get the manna you need for the day ...
Cole Huffman: yeah, I don't have anything to say- Mm-hmm ... worthwhile to anyone- Mm-hmm ... unless He gives it, and I really believe He does. And so ... But I, I ... If I stop preaching tomorrow, um, just the wa- walking with people, present to people-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm ...
Cole Huffman: helping them understand, not that I have every insight, but helping them understand struggle and suffering-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm
Cole Huffman: as well as their joys and their satisfactions in life, you know, um, that's been rewarding. Yeah. You know? It's not just been the preaching. I, I've kinda led with my preaching. My preaching has credentialed everything else I've done in ministry- Right ... through the years. Mm-hmm. But, um, without the preaching, I'd still wanna draw near people and, and, and be a [00:22:00] help if I can.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: Sounds real general, but- Well,
Mike Glenn: well, no, the interesting thing is- Yeah ... and I've, I've gone through the same thing. Mm-hmm. Uh, 'cause I love to preach.
Cole Huffman: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: You know, for the, the, the vast mata- uh, part of my ministry, that wa- that was what I lived for Was that. And now you get to a point where, I was talking to a friend the other day, and I said, "You know, the, the weird thing about my life right now is I, I don't need a platform."
Yeah. I don't, I don't need the, the, to, to preach every Sunday. Yeah. And, and f- for me to hear myself say this, it's like, "Dude, what's wrong?" Right? Yeah. But my joy comes, and my success now is in pouring your, your life into younger pastors, other pastors- Yeah ... and watching them succeed.
Cole Huffman: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: You know?
Cole Huffman: I think there really is a joy in that. Oh, yeah. And it, and it, I, I want to believe, and I do believe that that is some indication that you've kinda learned the key in this. Yeah. [00:23:00] And that is that whether you talk about pouring yourself out or, you know, it's-
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Or like I tell people- Yeah ... wisdom means you sh- I screwed up before you did.
That's all wisdom is. I've got the marks- Yeah ... on my body to bear. Yeah. Yeah. As Paul says, "I bear on my body." I know,
Cole Huffman: I know this one. But that, even that is, like, those are precious, valuable things- Mm-hmm ... um, that you take nothing for. Yeah. I'd never wanna go back and repeat-
Mike Glenn: No ... the mistakes or the- No, but I won't give back the lesson I learned either
absolutely not. No. Yeah. What do you do, what do you do to stay, um, spiritually healthy for this long, for this long haul?
Cole Huffman: I read widely.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And so even in reading non-Christians, I don't read trash, but just- Yeah ... you know, not everybody I read's Christian. And seeing, um, them articulating things that I, I know where that comes [00:24:00] from.
Yeah. You know? God's creati- Gr- God's creativity. Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And
Cole Huffman: reading widely has been a big lifeblood thing for me. Right.
Mike Glenn: Um, I, um- What are you reading now? Which one- Right now- Which one do you understand now? ...
Cole Huffman: I'm reading, um, I got, um, I'm rereading a book by Eugene Peterson called The Contemplative Pastor.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. Classic.
Cole Huffman: A buddy asked me to read it with him, so I think it's the third time I've read it. And it's, it's amazing how you get new things- Oh, yeah ... that you just never- Yeah ... saw before. Yeah. Or I'll see what I marked 20 years ago. Um, I'm reading a book by a guy who during COVID, um, became a mailman in Blacksburg, Virginia.
I saw that. Mailman. I saw the
Mike Glenn: article on that
Cole Huffman: book. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: Uh, he was an economist. Right. I guess he still is, but he was out of a job. He found out in the Charlotte Airport that he was [00:25:00] axed, and so he goes home to Blacksburg, where he- lives and he becomes a mailman. And it's kinda his year- Yeah.
It's, you know. Not a Christian. Um, it's, there's a lot of, uh, profanity in the book, but he's, he's, he is himself.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: I let authors be themselves. And then I'm reading a, a, a book that N.T. Wright's son put together of a lot of his, um, insights from his books on, uh, the things like the ascension and Easter- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm
and it's called On Earth as in Heaven, and that's been really good.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Anything by N.T. Wright, you, you've spent some time with- Yeah. I found
Cole Huffman: Wright is, he makes me think.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: I appreciate authors that make me think.
Mike Glenn: No, yeah, I don't, yeah, I don't necessarily mean to agree with them all the time, but- Right.
Yeah ... I like to wrestle with them.
Cole Huffman: I always say I don't agree with myself all the time either. So I, I have to, I have to give authors their due. So the reading [00:26:00] widely.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Reading scripture. I'm just staying with the scriptures. Um, amazing how you can get away from that. You know? Admit- And, and you're, you're- Yeah
a pastor, you're opening a Bible every week- Yeah ... but you could have not read it. And so I just, I just made a, I, I've, I use the M'Cheyne calendar. I've been using it for- Mm-hmm ... forever. I get behind, and I don't worry about it. I just go the next day. And then I, I do think o- one reason, uh, in the Peterson book, it's fresh top of mind 'cause I'm reading about it, the prayer life.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Um, I use prayer cards, but I've been using The Valley of Vision book a lot. Yes.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. A- again, a, a- They're fantastic ... one of the underground classics.
Cole Huffman: They're fantastic. Yeah. Mm-hmm. I mean, so many times I open that, and the lines, it's just like, I... There's times I'll just, just kinda drop it in my lap and just go, "Lord, that's exactly-
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm
Cole Huffman: what I wanna say to you." Mm-hmm. "And [00:27:00] thank you for this." Mm-hmm. So I've been loving that. Uh, Cornelius Plantinga has a prayer book called Morning and Evening. Mm-hmm. I've enjoyed that. Um, John Bailey has one. I've actually tried to incorporate prayer books a little more- Mm-hmm ... um, than I ever have in the last few years.
Mike Glenn: Have you found that discipline, uh, helpful?
Cole Huffman: The, the written prayers? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of, uh, Plant- Plantinga gives in his Morning and Evening in the intro, um, the justification for using written prayers.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: And he gives about four things. I won't remember them, but I think one of them is that, um, we, we get stale.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
Cole Huffman: And so the-
Mike Glenn: St- start saying the same words over and over again in our prayer, yeah ... yeah, somebody else's language- Mm-hmm ...
Cole Huffman: or way of putting it.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Or I didn't even think to pray that, you know. I think it's expanding- [00:28:00]
Mike Glenn: Yeah It's
Cole Huffman: not limiting me. It's expanding
Mike Glenn: me Or, or someti- or sometimes somebody writes down exactly as you were saying earlier.
Yeah "This is exactly what I wanted," say. Yeah. That's what I experienced when I wrote, when I read, uh, I Stand by the Door by Samuel Shoemaker. Mm-hmm. The poem that- Mm-hmm ... that he wrote about his ministry. Yeah. You know, I wrote, I said, I said, "This guy's been reading my mail." You know, this-
Cole Huffman: Well, it's interesting you mention that, 'cause another thing I've tried to incorporate is poetry.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
Cole Huffman: Um, which I guess, you know, for some reason g- uh, my parents didn't give me this sense. I think it just growing up in the context I grew up- Mm-hmm ... there was some sort of poetry is for sissies or something, you know?
Mike Glenn: Yeah. But- You grew up in North Alabama. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: Grew up on sports fields in North Alabama.
That's, that's it. That's it. You know, "What, you're reading poetry?" Yeah, that's
Mike Glenn: right. "What's wrong with you, boy?" "What's wrong with you,
Cole Huffman: son?" Um, but man, I have gained, um... In fact, there's a little poem I've just been meditating on it this week. It's by Lucy Shaw, who my mom knew. [00:29:00] Um, I think she taught at Regent College in Vancouver.
Mm-hmm. It's a little poem called Forecast, and it says, uh, "Planting seeds inevitably, uh, changes my feelings about rain."
Mike Glenn: Ah. Isn't that good? Yeah. Well, there's something the po- Yeah ... you and I spend our life in words. Yeah. The poet spends their life in how few words can I use. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: And, and they pick pictorial words- Yeah
that are full, full flower words. Of, of wa- yeah. They've got pollen, leaves- Yeah ... flowers, petals. Um, Christian Wiman is a poet I've been reading some. Mm-hmm. His theology is Christian Church. He's a Yale divinity guy. But I, uh, and even that, I mean, you, you just learn to pick through and- Yeah ... you know? I don't- L- look-
don't have to read everything that agrees with me. No,
Mike Glenn: you don't have to pick up everything on a smorgasbord. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. You [00:30:00] can, you can- Yeah ... you can leave some stuff. Yeah. Yeah.
Cole Huffman: We've got a nice, uh, Asian buffet out in Bellevue that, uh- Yeah. You- ... uh, makes me think of. You know what they- Uh, yeah.
Uh, there's certain things I'm not gonna pick up. That's right. And they've got usually three chili-
Mike Glenn: Oh ... pictures behind 'em. Yeah, yeah. That's right. I can't do the hot stuff. Uh. Yeah, can't, can't do that. We're gonna have to do this again. Yeah. I, I have, uh- Let's go ... I have enjoyed this. Yeah. Uh, a- as, as we wrap up, let, let's, let remind us of a couple of important things that, that Cole has talked about.
One, uh, it take the time you need to heal. A lot of us are going through hard times. Uh, you don't wanna rush that healing. You need the time so that you can be prepared to do in your life what God wants to do in the future. So whatever it ha- you have to do to identify the pain, address the pain, get to a good counselor, uh, and, and, and, and, and treat your pain with res- the, the respect it deserves.
Um- Uh, understand how [00:31:00] basic this, this life is. Uh, you know, I know we read a lot about th- this guy and this guy and this guy, but a lot of this is blocking and tackling. It's walking with people who are going through hard times. It's celebrating with people who are, uh, who are rejoicing. It's being there to grab your little two-year-old granddaughter when she panics in the church in the middle of a wedding.
Uh, it doesn't get better than that. So I hope you're encouraged. This is, uh, the Engaged Church Network podcast. This is Cole Huffman. He is the pastor of the Gospel Church here in Nashville, and I'm Mike Glenn, and we'll see you next time.
Thanks for tuning in to the Engaged Church Network podcast. We exist to train healthy and skilled leaders for congregations throughout Middle Tennessee. If today's episode helped you, share it with a fellow leader, and don't forget to visit [00:32:00] engagedchurchnetwork.com for more ways to grow.
