Ministry in the Neighbhorhood | David Jordan
Thirty-one years of neighborhood ministry has taught David Jordan one thing: the church has to go where people are, not wait for people to come. Mike Glenn talks with the CEO of Agape Memphis about embedding ministry in communities, the complexity of poverty, and what long-term commitment actually looks like on the ground.
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Mike Glenn: Uh, we welcome David Jordan to our podcast today from Agape, Memphis. Thank you. We are, uh, we're really excited about you being here. Thank you because, um. What you are doing, I think is so important to how the Future Church is going to exist and thrive in, uh, in the North American culture. So just to help our folks get caught up with, uh, what you do and where you are, tell us about a few minutes about, uh, agape Memphis.
David Jordan: Yeah, yeah. Uh, so, so David Jordan, I'm the president, CEO at Agape, uh, in Memphis. Mm-hmm. Called Agape Child in Family Services. Uh, this is my 31st year. God brought us there. Um, agape is, uh, will be 56 years old here in just a few days. So it began in 1970, uh, launched through churches, specifically churches of Christ.
The first one actually was here in Nashville. Uh, we [00:01:00] have one in the one in Memphis and Atlanta, a couple of in Alabama, North Carolina. Uh, agape began. Uh, focusing on foster care and adoption. Mm-hmm. And so a lot of people would know the name and think, oh, y'all, y'all are the foster care people, right?
Mm-hmm. Um, and we did that for a lot of years. Uh, my background, uh, professionally has been in this field for 40 years, um, and, and did a lot of that work. Um, about almost, uh, 18, 17, 18 years ago, we began asking the question, what does it look like to go deeper in neighborhoods? Mm-hmm. And so, uh, I know we'll talk more about that.
Uh, but we began going in neighborhoods where the kids lived before they came into foster care. And we began asking the question, what would be most helpful to you before getting into a system? Mm-hmm. And so that changed our trajectory hugely so, 17, 18 years ago. How so? Um, so we, we began asking families.
Mm-hmm. What, what would be most helpful to you? Just those living in neighborhoods and communities, and most of them are [00:02:00] impoverished, under-resourced neighborhoods and family said, uh, if you really want to help me, uh, I don't feel safe in my neighborhood. Um, so can you help me feel safer? If you really want to help me, can you help me, uh, with my kids in school?
So that they not only do well in school, but will they be in a school that it makes any difference the piece of paper they might get
Mike Glenn: right?
David Jordan: When, when they mm-hmm. Graduate from high school, if you really wanna help me, can you help me get a job or more of a job to really, uh, sub. Port financially my family.
Mm-hmm. Uh, if you really want to help me, can you help my family with inside our, our home walls, uh, relationships, what's going on between, uh, parent, child, or children? Uh, just all the dynamics in, in the household. Uh, and then in the center of that was, uh, do we have any hope? Is there any hope that, uh, the generations that, that I came before, I'm kind of living out this same kind of pattern, the same [00:03:00] trajectory.
Will there be any hope for myself or my kids? And so as we sat with that and listened to it, we said, you know. Waiting for kids to come into foster care and there's a time that there's a need for kids to come into foster care. Mm-hmm. And, and I have lots of stories around that. Um, but waiting for kids to come in into any system versus Jesus model of going into the neighborhood, being where the people are at, and walking with them where they're at, changed us.
Huge.
Mike Glenn: Hugely. But they talk about going upstream.
David Jordan: Exactly.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: Yep. That's
Mike Glenn: right. Solve the problem before it becomes a problem.
David Jordan: That's right. That's right. And, and that's language that, that we use a lot of. Mm-hmm. Going upstream. And so, uh, so we said, okay, we'll begin walking with you. Just like that. To try to prevent kids from coming into foster care mm-hmm.
As well as lots of other life matters. Uh, and bring resources and services. 'cause there's a lot of strength in those neighborhoods as well. Mm-hmm. Um, and so we went deep in schools and so, uh, had staff embedded in 17 schools, kindergarten to 12th grade [00:04:00] in the neighborhood. Where families live. Uh, we partner deeply with churches in those neighborhoods.
Um, and so having staff and other nonprofits embedded in the, those churches in those neighborhoods mm-hmm. Uh, we went deep where people live in apartments or kinda the surrounding area, they, they're residents. Um, and so my staff don't, don't go to an office, like a central office. Mm-hmm. They go into the neighborhood, they go to the communities.
And so we're in four large, under-resourced neighborhoods in Memphis. Um, for those who might know these neighborhoods, Frazier, white Haven, Hickory Hill, and Raleigh, and we've been asked to go into three additional neighborhoods, um, orange Mound, south Memphis, north Memphis, those neighborhoods together make up about where 80% who ask
Mike Glenn: you, who ask you to go into the neighborhood.
David Jordan: So these are neighbors, community partners, churches. Schools, so those that have seen the work Okay. And experienced that and kind of, kind of gr grapevine mm-hmm. You know, on the street what's happening. Mm-hmm. Um, and, and so as we discern [00:05:00] through that and as God provides resources, uh, we've gone deep in those four neighborhoods and have these three other.
Yeah. Those together make up about where 80% of those that live in poverty in Memphis reside. Mm-hmm. And so, so we're trying to go deep in those neighborhoods really from a, a lens of kingdom come, what does it look like, uh, through the body of Christ in its fullness. Not just the four walls of where a church building's at, but the fullness of the body of Christ in the kingdom, in those neighborhoods.
And so, so, so that's what we, we have done for now, 17, 18 years.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. How did you get connected? To Agape.
David Jordan: So, so lived here in Nashville for, um, uh, my college years. Mm-hmm. Came to Lipscomb, uh, met my wife, um, uh, went to a church here. Uh, some folks would know that, the name, uh, Dr. Ruble. Shelly, uh, who had huge impact on, on my life in terms of,
Mike Glenn: and mine.
And yours
David Jordan: as well.
Mike Glenn: He is a great friend.
David Jordan: Yes, yes. Great friend. Yes. And, uh, uh, helped me come to know [00:06:00] Jesus. In a very personal way that I didn't know as a kid growing up. And, um, and then began coming to know Jesus from the, the vantage point of kingdom and what that means. Mm-hmm. And so as we were here in, in Nashville, and those are beautiful years, uh, had two of our first th of our three children and, and receive a calling to come to Memphis.
And, uh, we were going, actually going through the, the Henry Blackaby uh, work. Right. Yeah. And, and, uh, ruble was preaching from it and we were in a small group experiencing God, and, and, um, I think it had not been for that tool, uh, Blackaby tool and that small group. I, I would not have been necessarily faithful to God's calling to go to Memphis.
And, and because we came to Nashville, Nashville was just a breath of fresh air for us spiritually, right?
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Uh, but, but clearly came, God is calling us to go to Memphis. So 95, uh, went to Memphis and it's been beautiful. It's been a, a beautiful place to raise our children now, five [00:07:00] grandchildren. Mm-hmm.
Uh, and going deep in the ministry God's given us.
Mike Glenn: Okay. Uh, folks like you always have a story.
David Jordan: Hmm.
Mike Glenn: Uh, a a I was going through my life and
then
Mike Glenn: boom, this hit, changed everything about what I thought was important. What's your story?
David Jordan: Uh, my dear friend, Terry Smith. What would, uh, tell, tell you to tell your story?
Um, so I, I, I grew up. Uh, in a, a good home, good family in the, in the church. Um, I was born with a cleft lip and, and was, uh, I think God's way of marking me early. Um, people would, uh, uh, would say things like, uh, mean you look like monster man, or You look, I mean, all and, and so early in life. Uh, a question deep in my spirit was, do I have value?
Mike Glenn: Hmm.
David Jordan: Am I loved? Am I [00:08:00] lovable? Uh, and, and God, God began answering that for me and to me. Um, and there's a whole storyline with that. Um. And as I got older, uh, as an adult, uh, and became to know, know God's love in Jesus', love for me, uh, the question began turning for me of, uh, David, I've showed you my love.
Mm-hmm. And I'll keep doing that now. I want you to go be that for others who have the same kind of question in their heart. And, um, and so that, that has fueled me for all of my life. Um. Answering one of those live questions that then become the question God uses. Mm-hmm. For me to try to be to others.
Mike Glenn: How did you end up in social work?
David Jordan: Um, I went to Lipscomb. I got my major in Bible.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Uh, never since being called to preach or pastor, uh, but as immature as it was. Um, uh, knew I was called to help people. Um, [00:09:00] and, and so graduated and then was lost puppy. Didn't know what I was going to do. I mean, I was just, uh, started driving a truck. Uh, just trying to figure it out.
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
David Jordan: Uh, dating my, my now wife. Um. And then, uh, the, the, the pathway to social work kind of illuminated for me. And so I went to University of Tennessee here in, in Nashville and got my master's in social work. Mm-hmm. And, and so God began blending that Bible major and that social work masters together. And, and so I began working in the field once I, well, as I had my master's, I worked with the state of Tennessee.
Mm-hmm. Uh, did child protective services work, so Wow. Going in homes. Where there's alleged abuse and neglect, and I mean, I was green, as green could be.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: And, um, had two cases, very, very unfortunately, where, uh, young children, a baby died by virtue of abuse. One that, that marked another marking in my life in [00:10:00] 1987, a little fellow named Corey Orr, four years of age.
And, uh. Had just been literally beaten to death. And, uh, and I was young, as young could be. Uh, back when there were beepers, I was on call and got the call to go to Vanderbilt Hospital and I saw this little 4-year-old boy, uh, in the hospital, unconscious, uh, just literally beaten to death. And, uh, probably fortunate for Corey, he died the next day.
And, and it, it turned me upside down. Um, I wrecked my car. I just, I, I couldn't even focus, uh, and, and almost left the field. And I had a good mentor that said, uh, uh, David, God has called you to be here. He will not leave you. Mm-hmm. He is with you. And, uh, he will use this tragedy, uh, in a way that will be good for others.
And so I call little Corey's name occasionally out. Um. Uh, [00:11:00] because God has used the tragedy, just terrible tragedy of his life. To bring good to others. Mm-hmm. And so, so that was part of, of my story to kind of move through where I'm at now. Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Okay. Now, listening to you reading your background stuff, um, you're not, you're not a pastor of a church
David Jordan: right?
Mike Glenn: But David, you sound like a pastor
David Jordan: occasionally. People call me pastor.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Uh, and, and I think, I think this is kind of, uh, uh, important for us to talk about in this transition that the church in North America is in. Mm-hmm. Uh, uh, you've talked about going to the neighborhoods. Mm-hmm. You're talking about embedding in the neighborhoods?
Yes. Yes. Going deep in the neighborhoods. That's right. Partnering with churches, but not staying within the church. Mm. Okay. Mm. Uh, we live in a time now, uh, a time now when, um, the ministry comes before the message. Mm-hmm. Mm. Okay. Mm-hmm. You know, I grew up [00:12:00] probably like you did with the Billy Graham School of Evangelism.
Mm-hmm. And we were told Yeah. You know, just to cold call and, and share the gospel and expected decision. Yeah. Now for a lot of reasons that we don't have time to talk about today. Yeah. People are very jaded Mm. About the gospel. Mm. And they're wondering if the church can make any real difference. So when they see a ministry like Agape Yeah.
Uh, making a difference not only in the child's life, but in the whole system. Yeah, yeah. Of, uh, that, that is engaged with that child. Yeah. Then they became more open to the gospel. Mm-hmm. So what we're talking to, um, uh, to churches about now is find a problem in the community. And solve it. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
We call it the Mother Theresa rule. Mm-hmm. Go where nobody wants to go. Amen. And do what nobody wants to do. Amen. And if you do that Mm, then uh, the other doors will open for you. Mm-hmm. Now, poverty for most churches is a special offering at [00:13:00] Christmas. Mm. You and I know it is more than that. That's right.
That's right. So, e explain to me what you find out, what, what you found out in this generational. Web of, of poverty.
David Jordan: Yeah. Yeah. So maybe a story that would connect with that. Um, as we've gone deep in neighborhoods, uh, poverty and all that, it means, and a lot of times when we hear poverty, we think economic, and that's part of it.
Uh, but that is only a part of it. Right? And it is a web. That's a good way of saying it. Uh, it's very complex that there's so many dynamics that go with poverty. 'cause a lot of folks would say, man, why don't you just, are you lazy? Just up and out what you know. Mm-hmm. Um. And, and, and it's deep for most families.
So we're in a neighborhood called Frazier, uh, which in the seventies was a middle class community doing well, economic engines, businesses mm-hmm. Left that community. Um, the, the [00:14:00] population began shifting and changing and, and now it is more,
Mike Glenn: was there anything that prompted that?
David Jordan: Uh, it, it was the closing.
You had a tire factory. You, you just, ah, you so, so, so, so you just had some economic changes going on mm-hmm. In, in, in the neighborhood and the community.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. And in Nashville It is, it is the construction of I 40.
David Jordan: Hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mike Glenn: That split neighborhoods
David Jordan: open and Yeah. And you just drive right by 'em.
You don't see 'em. That's right. Split 'em up. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and so, and, and you don't get seen. Mm-hmm. And you don't, and, and, and so your voice is not heard.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: And, and so, uh, Frazier is now, um. Has a lot of beauty in it, and it's where, uh, more kids going into foster care than almost any other neighborhood.
Uh, I mean, and you could just add onto the list of all the kinda matters going on. So we're deep in a church. It's called Pursuit of God Church, who with a partner, uh, with a pastor, ambassador Ricky Floyd, who actually passed a year ago. Mm-hmm. Almost exactly a year ago. Uh, said we were covenant partners.
He [00:15:00] and I, deep partnership and relationship. So he's at his church and we're, we're embedded in his church and we're in a school that's across the way from his church, elementary school. And we're embedded, got staff embedded there. Mm-hmm. And the, the principal, and he tells me this story. I wasn't even present for this, even though my staff are all involved.
Um, the principal picks up the phone and calls Pastor Floyd and says, pastor, you've gotta get over here. I got a mama. She is just going crazy. She got two boys, her students here in our, our school, our elementary school, and she just mad as a wet hand. Mm-hmm. Can, can you do something about it? And so pastor said, why don't you just send her over to me, just cross over the street and come over see me.
Mm-hmm. And so, so the mama does, uh, she gets over there and I mean, pastor as Pastor Floyd would tell the story, just said she really was mad and just looked at him just up and down, like, what, what do you want? And he, hi, I'm Pastor Floyd. Mm-hmm. Anything I can do? And she said, no, there's probably nothing you can do for me.
Well, um, I understand you're having some difficulties school. Yeah. I'm having some hard time with that school and that, that school needs to, [00:16:00] they need to fire that principal. Mm-hmm. Um, well, would you like me to pray for you? Yeah, pastor, if you want pray, go ahead. You you go ahead. Go ahead and just pray.
So he prays with her, comes out a prayer and said, is there anything else I can do for you? Well, I'm hungry. You wanna do something about that? Well, actually we've got this partnership with Agape and lots of other non-profits and so right down my hall in, in, in our church building here, uh, we have food through another non-profit.
Would you like some food so I can have some food today? You're welcome to go down there and get What does it cost me? Not a thing. Ma'am. Would you like to go down? Mm-hmm. Well, yeah, I, I'll do that. And so she goes down and she gets food and they box it up. And so he said, uh, ma'am, is there anything else I can do for you?
And she said, well, you, you've been kind, uh, we got carjacked. Anything you knew about that? And he said, well, uh, I don't know. Tell me what, well, my, my boys, they're, they're upset. They're acting out at school. I'm mad I'm hurt. I mean, [00:17:00] right. He said, well, we have up upstairs, he calls it, called it this, his upper room.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Upstairs ape's got counselors and, and folks that do mental health kinda work. And we're, now, we're not crazy. Now, I didn't say you're crazy, uh, but you, you've gone through some stuff. You, you got carjacked pulled a gun on you. Uh, yeah, they did. Would, would you like I can set 'em up to see 'em today after they get outta school.
Well, okay. Alright. Anything else I can do for you, ma'am? Mm-hmm. Um, well, since I got carjacked, I can't get to my job and so I've been fired. I, I can't get there. Mm-hmm. Can you do anything about jobs? Well, gpe with lots of other partners have a work fair here and, and so, we'll, they'll have employers here tomorrow if you come back.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: And, and they, some of 'em hire on the spot. Would you like to come to that? Well, okay, I'll come to that. She comes to that and gets hired on the spot making $18 an hour and, um, and, and so her life starts, well, a couple weeks later, the school calls pastor and [00:18:00] said, pastor, this mom's back over here.
You gotta get over here. He, oh my goodness. What? What's going wrong there? No, no, no, no, no. This is good. You need to get over here. So he goes over to the school, across the street and, and they're high fing and she's hugging and, and, and, and he, she sees him and again. Mm-hmm. He's telling me the story and said she gives him a big hug and says, pastor, I, I just, I just, I came back here just to apologize, apologized to the school, apologize for how I was acting out a couple weeks ago.
I wanna apologize to you and, uh, thank you for how. You've really helped me.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: And, and I didn't know that a church cared that much. I just thought, y'all, I come, I come. You just want my money. Yeah. And that's right. Do you really care? And, uh, he said, ma'am, we do care. And she said, you know what? I used to go to church.
And he said, well, you'd be welcome to come to our church. Well, she started coming to their church, began being a part of their church body, still struggling in life. But being together, walking it out.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: And, and I think that epitomizes, not every story's that way, but it [00:19:00] epitomizes kinda who we are in trying to be kind of to your earlier point.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Can you see me in my pain, in my hurt? Mm-hmm. Um. I don't trust the church. I had a bad experience, or I've moved away from it, or whatever my life experience was. Uh, but you met me where I was at and, and so that's who we are trying to be, what I would call the fullness of the gospel. Right. And meeting people exactly where they're at in the very moment when you meet 'em.
Mike Glenn: Okay. All right. So I am, uh, a average church member. I get fired up about poverty or worse.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: I did something a couple of years ago and got burned out.
David Jordan: Yeah. Yeah,
Mike Glenn: because it is so overwhelming.
David Jordan: Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Okay, so how does Agape form a system? Yeah. That can then address the complexities of poverty.
David Jordan: Yeah, yeah.
Yeah. It's a great question. Uh, 'cause there are a lot of people, good [00:20:00] hearted people
Mike Glenn: Yeah.
David Jordan: Who, who've tried and, and, and maybe it's over,
Mike Glenn: it's overwhelming
David Jordan: and, and it will be overwhelming. Mm-hmm. Almost every time. Or I tried and I got burnt.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Um, and, and that's not uncommon. Uh, I've been overwhelmed.
I've gotten burned, and so I get it. I get it. Um, 'cause as we fight poverty, uh, I say we fight it spiritually, economically, educationally, relationally, systemically. There's so many factors going on. And so what we are trying to do and what we're doing is walk walking alongside churches, uh, walking inside the school sector.
Mm-hmm. Being in the neighborhoods and saying, as we holistically wrap around a family, how can the body of Christ come along with their giftedness? And I, I'm, I'm a CEO of a company, and, and I could, I could create a pathway to jobs.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Well, if you do it by yourself and you can, um, then what about when transportation comes up?
Right? What about childcare issues? What about. When they come [00:21:00] in, they cuss out their boss. What, you know, all the things that can happen. Mm-hmm. Uh, so, so we are, uh, walking alongside and we're saying, okay, here are the kind of things you gotta, here are the pathway to get to a job like that. Mm-hmm. And here the life matters and how do we help you support and, and when things happen.
And almost every time. Something's going to happen,
Mike Glenn: right?
David Jordan: How do we keep walking with you and how do we have the body of Christ be a part of that? Mm-hmm. CEO says, you know, I can get 'em a job, but I can't be a social worker.
Mike Glenn: That's
right.
David Jordan: And so can you. I don
Mike Glenn: don't have time to raise 'em,
David Jordan: is what they're, yeah.
And that's just not trying to be a good person, good hearted man. I feel convicted around this, but you always say, great. Help us be part of the, kind of the, the village, if you will.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: With many other nonprofits, other groups, and you'll be a piece of that mm-hmm. To walk alongside this family.
Mike Glenn: One part of that.
One part of this. Exactly.
David Jordan: That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right.
Mike Glenn: Everybody has a slice of the pie.
David Jordan: That's
Mike Glenn: right. But nobody has the whole pie.
David Jordan: That's right. Which is I [00:22:00] think the beauty and the imagery of the body of Christ.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: Somebody's the arm, somebody's the leg, somebody's the eye.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: But it takes all of us to be one body
Mike Glenn: to be functioning.
David Jordan: That's right. That's right. That's right. So that's who we really try and, and so we, we come along, we have what we call hub churches, and so those churches in the neighborhoods that know the people have a heartbeat of the people, often pastors that are kind of gatekeepers.
Mm-hmm. I mean, they're viewed as leaders and, and so we embed in those churches, we bring other nonprofits. Agape can't do it all. And, and so we bring other nonprofits and groups there, and then we invite, uh, what we call resource churches. Mm-hmm. And so those that have more resources, whatever those might be, and to partner with a hub church, uh, to, to say, you know, what does it look like together?
I mean, example of this is, uh, uh, pastor Steve Gaines, I don't wanna call his name out. Right. Who just passed away.
Mike Glenn: Just, just passed away. Steve's a good friend.
David Jordan: Good. Yes. Yes. And, and Steve and his wife Donna. Mm-hmm. Good friends. Mm-hmm. Um, pastor Bellevue Baptist, the largest, uh, Southern Baptist [00:23:00] church, uh, I guess in the world, maybe.
Mike Glenn: Mm.
David Jordan: Steve wanted to come see the work, and this was five, six years ago, and, and he, he admittedly said, man, David, what y'all are talking about Sounds good. But I gotta come see it.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: Well, they had built,
Mike Glenn: the pastors have been burned too.
David Jordan: Yes, yes. We might flip this and ask you, right? That's right. Yeah. Um, well, so Steve, and, and, and I loved his heart.
He said, I wanna come see this. I'm hearing about it. Mm-hmm. I'm hearing good stories. Uh, and we've, and Bellevue had bought a, a building in the Frazier neighborhood, a church building. Mm-hmm. And, and they had been through multiple pastors. It just, it wasn't working Right. But I'm hearing these goods. How do these two things go together?
And so he came and uh, and, and they started asking questions and looking at it and, uh, and then became convicted and said, man, David, uh, my wife and I, Donna, are walking alongside a single mom and man, this is complex. Mm-hmm. This is hard work. Mm-hmm. I said, pastor, you're exactly right. I said, and rarely can one person by themselves do it.
It really takes a village. Mm-hmm. It takes a [00:24:00] body to do it. Well, coming out of that, uh, he and Pastor Floyd then began working with each other, getting to know each other and what Bellevue did through Pastor Steve Gaines, they said, you know what, we probably can't do, uh, Frazier work in the Bellevue Way.
Mm-hmm. But we could gift this church to someone like a Pastor Floyd, who knows the, the church Right. And the community. And we could be in relationship with each other. Mm-hmm. And so they, they donated a $3 million facility with three years of operation. Operating capital to help expand that ministry. And so that was one way from church to church.
Mm-hmm. And so it wasn't Agape receiving any money that was, it was like, this is helping enhance this ministry. And now thousands of people in that neighborhood have been served by virtue of that relationship. And because of a pastor saying, I see something. I see where God's working. Right.
Mike Glenn: Um, who is it that, uh, wrote, uh, when helping Herz?
David Jordan: Yes,
Mike Glenn: yes,
David Jordan: yes, yes. Uh,
Mike Glenn: er,
David Jordan: Brian Fier.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Brian Fier. [00:25:00] Uh, his, his conclusion is poverty is the lack of access. Mm-hmm. Mm. Uh, and that, and then what you're talking about here Yeah. Is, uh, Steve and Bellevue didn't have access to the people that they wanted to help. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Uh, pastor Floyd didn't have access to the, to the resources that's he needed.
That's right. That's right. Uh, but with the help of Agape
David Jordan: mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Then those connections were made
David Jordan: together. Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And, uh, access was. Was open both ways.
David Jordan: That's right. That's right. And, and so, uh, access for the people themselves, access to two pastors that had not been together. Mm-hmm. And so they're learning from each other.
It's not just a one way street. Um, and then access for families and all the stories that have come out of what's happening there. And then access to, for other nonprofits to be able to partner to now being in a larger building to be able to do their work. Yeah. To be on, on the
Mike Glenn: ground.
David Jordan: Because the nonprofit [00:26:00] world also can be extraordinarily siloed.
And organizations doing their own thing. Um, and so bringing that together and then people in the community saying, okay, 'cause my goal is, man, if you're looking for life, that's where you go for life. Mm-hmm. If you want the real stuff, that's where you go. Um, and, and so creating those kind of oasis in the desert, uh, to bring, able to bring living water to families.
Mike Glenn: So tell me, um, I am a, uh, a pastor. Wanna do good stuff. Don't know how to even begin.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm. Hmm.
Mike Glenn: Uh, maybe I've done some reading, maybe I've done to a conference or two. Yeah. And walked back and says, yeesh. I don't even know where to start.
David Jordan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, when you and I were talking earlier, I, I, I believe it to be true.
Um. What is it that God has put deep on your heart as your passion and your ministry? What, [00:27:00] what, what, what is that passion? Mm-hmm. You asked me what drives me? Mm-hmm. What is it that drives you? Uh, that there's a church, uh, in another neighborhood we serve, and, and they have a, a food ministry and, and, and so it's, it's like they're in a, a just a food desert.
And so how do we, you know, feed the people, but they're also very aware the same people are coming. Every week for food. I mean, we, we have to keep eating right. We eat every day. Right. Um, and he said, man, how could we expand this food ministry in a way to go deeper in feeding the soul, the being all of the, the personhood, the family?
Mm-hmm. And, and, and so that's where we began with them. Uh, we work with churches that say, man, I have a, I have a passion around fathers. Mm-hmm. And fatherhood. And we said, let's begin right there. Um, and, and so we do what we call a no wrong door. So whatever door folks come to you at with. Man, I'm a single father and I'm struggling.
I just came outta prison and I've just come back in. Mm-hmm. Man, my kids are, are about to go into [00:28:00] foster care or they're coming back from foster care, or I can't get a job, or, you know, whatever life matter might be. Mm-hmm. Begin there. So what's the door? The church is
Mike Glenn: Yeah. That no wrong door philosophy is, is big with agape.
Yes. Okay. Yes. Explain that to us.
David Jordan: Yes. Yes. And so, um, most often in, in the human services social services world, uh, folks think about programs and I get funding for programs. Mm-hmm. And so we do food, we do foster care, we do workforce, we do childcare, we do, uh, mentoring, whatever it might be. And, and, and I've been doing this long enough and I said, you know.
Why do we make people, individuals, families have to figure out where the programs are at. Yeah. What door to go through. Mm-hmm. You know, and, and do I qualify? Why don't we make that our job? And so it's our job to, uh, in integrate all those different fundings with different partners so that when a family comes and says, here's what I need, I trust that you know best what you need.
Mm-hmm. First. [00:29:00] And if you say that, then it's my job to just open the door and say, walk in.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Now you've gotta do the work, but can I open that door? So no wrong door is when you come to me and you say, here's what my need is, food. Mentoring, help with school, help with the job, help, whatever that might, would you
Mike Glenn: pray from a gospel principle of starting where right where you are,
David Jordan: right where you're at.
Jesus went in the neighborhood. Yeah. And he just began walking with the people. And so, so in my opinion, how do we create that? And we do that in, in the church. We also do it in the, in the, uh, public sector within the schools. Mm-hmm. And so those being community resource hubs as well. Uh, so that wherever you might go.
Uh, we're being the body of Christ in that place. In, in whatever door you wanna walk through, that's the door we begin with and then we start walking it out. 'cause then typically through relationship, 'cause it relationship is paramount through the relationship. Well, can you help me with this? Mm-hmm. Or what about that?
Can we have this kind of conversation and, and just [00:30:00] begin trying to opening other doors as you walk out. Which I view being the fullness of the gospel.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: So you're moving into some new areas. Yeah. Some, some new communities you've been invited in.
David Jordan: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: What's the process for establishing Go Agape Memphis in a new.
Neighborhood.
David Jordan: So, um, first have to be invited basically in mm-hmm. Are there, is, are there, uh, people saying, we really want you to be here, there, are there, uh, are we getting families who are calling us saying, Hey, can you serve me in our neighborhood? Do we have partners? Do we have churches? Mm-hmm. They were saying we could use this, and here's what we, so we have these conversations.
We, we go in, we, we begin talking to the neighbors themselves. Mm-hmm. And having those conversations.
Mike Glenn: I, I, I wanna stop you right here. Yeah. Because I think, I think you're going through a key. And I don't want us to rush through.
David Jordan: Alright.
Mike Glenn: A, a key point and that the reputation of Agape, the story from the other neighborhoods.
Cause the invitation in these new neighborhoods. Mm mm Right? [00:31:00] Mm. Okay. Again, back to the ministries before the message. Yeah. I'm gonna go and whatever door is open. Yeah. I'm gonna serve as best we can with the resources that we can connect with, right? And then as these people get help. Uh, who, who is it Newgen?
Said, uh, the guy, the evangelism was one. One bagger telling another bagger where he found bread. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So that began to spread. But this, this quality of consistent. Ministry of showing up. Yeah. And being there when people needed you. Yeah. And then allowing that to open the other doors.
Yeah. Yeah. You wait till you're invited, you wait till the doors open. Yeah. Then as you go through that open door that opens the other doors. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Now I'm, I'm, I'm from a evangelical tradition that says, you knocked the door down. You know, I get it, I get it. So that's, that's, uh, but [00:32:00] uh, for a lot of reasons now.
That is the worst thing you can do. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Uh, because, uh, well, you know, we talk about how churches have been burned and all that neighborhoods have been burned very much so. Very much so about government who's shown up, Hey, we're here to help. Mm-hmm. Uh, well-meaning nonprofits that didn't understand the complexity of what was going on.
Yeah.
David Jordan: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: And, uh, and showed up, made a bunch of promises and Yep. That's, and nothing happened. That's right.
David Jordan: That's right. Well, and, and I'm glad you slowed it up 'cause, 'cause that, that really is critical.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Um, uh, the, the very neighbors that we come alongside, uh, most often have been burnt and used. Uh, in the nonprofit world, it may be, uh, I'm trying to get a three year grant Right.
And funding. Mm-hmm. And, and so, so I need
Mike Glenn: your picture on my brochure.
David Jordan: Yes. And, um, and, and so they're, they're communities that, uh, will kick in in Memphis. They will kick you outta the [00:33:00] neighborhood, uh, if you come in wanting to treat the neighborhood like a client.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Um, and really use us. And um, uh, and then when your three year funding is gone, then you up and out.
Yeah. And you're gone. Uh, and then that has happened way too much. Right. Uh, good meaning churches, uh, you mentioned, you know, doing turkeys and all and those things can have their place, but when done in isolation, and that's kinda the only time you show up.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. Kind of the cynical.
David Jordan: Yeah. Then you know what the whole story of being here come the, the Turkey people.
Yeah. You know, uh, and, and, and so, so I, I think that that is really paramount in terms of your relationship, your intention, your commitment. Mm-hmm. Uh, one of the things from my board back in, uh, 2005, uh, said if we, we are, if we are really seeking generational change. And transformation in neighborhoods.
Mm-hmm. Then I believe we as an agency, need to make a generational commitment, and [00:34:00] so my board made an 18 year commitment, uh, back in 2005 saying, okay, if we're walking into a neighborhood in the community, we're going to be there. And we're not backing down.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: And, and so, and no matter what the funding does, and it goes up and down, uh, we're gonna be present.
Mm-hmm. And have presence. Uh, 'cause otherwise, 'cause word on the street is what makes you or breaks you and, and so, so, so you make a very good point. Yeah. And that is paramount, uh, in having a long-term vision. If God has given this to you mm-hmm. Then God will be faithful. And so remaining obedient through our heart times,
Mike Glenn: I, I remind people that there's a reason Jesus talked a lot about agriculture.
David Jordan: Mm mm
Mike Glenn: You work the dirt.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: And you wait.
David Jordan: That's right.
Mike Glenn: That's right. You, you plant the seed. That's right. That's right. And you wait. That's exactly right. Uh, so, you know, I, you know, you hear the story of Agape and say, Hey, they go in and, you know, the 1st of April, and by the end of April they've got it figured out.
But, but you're talking about an [00:35:00] 18 year commitment.
David Jordan: Yes. Yes. Uh, if, if we're looking for generational change, uh, am I willing to commit to you family and neighborhood as an organization, uh, if I'm asking you to make commitments mm-hmm. On your end, is there a mutuality
Mike Glenn: right
David Jordan: here? And so, uh, God really compelled that upon my heart and, and I'm thankful for a board that would say,
Mike Glenn: yeah,
David Jordan: we make that commitment.
Uh, and so, so, yeah. So it, it's, if you're gonna do this work, uh, and it is of God. Then treat it as it, it is is of God. Mm-hmm. And this is kingdom work. It is messy, it is hard. Uh, you'll wanna quit. You'll want to get, you'll be burnt. You'll have not every story turns out the, I mean all the things we know and yet.
It's exactly where Jesus went.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. David, you talked about the science of hope.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: Break that down for me.
David Jordan: Yeah. Yeah. So, so we, we have, when we went to neighborhoods, uh, when we asked [00:36:00] families, what do you need, what, what would be most helpful? Mm-hmm. Mentioned a number of those things in the center of it was this, this sense of lack of hope.
Hopelessness and that has stayed with us. You know, how, how do you embody, what does hope look like? And, and from a biblical mm-hmm. Standpoint, we'd say, yeah, hope is critical. Hope is essential to who we are.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Agape became aware of something called the Science of Hope, which sounds. Kind of an odd language together.
Uh, but folks wanna Google it, the Science of Hope. There's a Dr. Chan Hellman with the University of Oklahoma, who's been leading this work for over 20 years. Uh, he's a believer. Um, and, and it really is operationalizing hope. Um, hope, having an expectation of a future that tomorrow can be better than today, and that I have something to do about it.
Mike Glenn: Wow.
David Jordan: Um, and, and so do you have a goal? If you have a goal, it's really clear. Do you have pathways, multiple pathways to [00:37:00] get to that goal? Mm-hmm. 'cause one may not work, so, so do you have more, and then do you have the agency, the willpower to stay at it? To meet that goal. Relatively simple goal pathways to get to that goal.
Addressing barriers as they might come up, a plan for that. And then the motivation, the willpower to finish it out. And as you do that, rinse and repeat over and over 2,500 bodies of research, it would say, if you do that, the likelihood of your hope in leading you to wellbeing and flourishing mm-hmm. Is very high.
Uh, most research would say hope is one of, if not the most critical factor towards someone having wellbeing and flourishing.
Mike Glenn: Okay, go back, go back again. Yeah. Goal,
David Jordan: if you've got a goal that's very clear. Okay. And I wanna get a job. I wanna get a job making $20 an hour working in it. And, and, and so that's what I want for, for, for my next big thing.
Yeah. [00:38:00] Okay. What's your pathways to get
Mike Glenn: there? If to get there? Yeah, I have to
David Jordan: do this. Well, what are, what are the, what are, what is the plan to get there? What are the pathways? Well, I, I've gotta have a certain amount of education. I have to have certificates. Um, I've gotta have childcare while I'm doing that.
Is there transportation is. To get to the place I'm gonna go to, to have the training, uh, do I have some of the financial resources to be able to do that? You know, a range of all the life matters,
Mike Glenn: right?
David Jordan: To be able to make sure I can get that certificate mm-hmm. So that, that I can be, you know, available to that job.
And then do I have the motivation, the agency, okay. When, when man things hit and they don't go well, um, childcare just falls apart. Uh, I mean, whatever the life matters are. Do you have somebody around you? Do you have a community around you? What's gonna help? Keep your motivation, man, Mike, stay at it.
Mm-hmm. You can do this. Mm-hmm. You can make it through. You've hit a tough time. You've got another pathway to it. Okay. Your childcare went down. Do you have somebody else that can help with childcare? Right. All the different, you know, stay with it. Stay at it. You're gonna do it. You can do it, man. Remember your [00:39:00] goal.
Don't forget. Mm-hmm. Keep motivating yourself. And, and so being able to, to do that over and over and over again. Research shows in Agape experience, 'cause we've been using this model now for several years, is, uh, uh, 50% of the families we work with their, the parents have higher level of hope and they have better outcomes than the other families.
65% of the youth that we work with have higher. Uh, hope, uh, kinda expectation of hope, and they have better outcomes. And then, so I went to my mayor, our mayor here in Memphis, um, uh, mayor, uh, Paul Young, and I said, mayor, you know, there's, there's this whole movement of hope. And I know we talk about Memphis often being called the city of crime and lots of other things.
Mm-hmm. And we're not wanting to be known for that. What if. What if hope became, uh, kind of what we're do for mm-hmm. That we're a city of hope and what we're embodying is something called collective hope, not just an individual or family level, [00:40:00] but collective across the city of Memphis. And using this kind of framework of goals, pathways, and and agency to be able to get to that and that being a city movement.
Mayor, what do you think about that, David? I love it. Yeah. I'm, I'm a man of hope, right? I mean, what would I not like? Mm-hmm. What do you need? You see? Just kind of say, yep. That's good. I, I, I bless it. I said, mayor, would you lead this? He said, oh, you're asking me a different question. And I said, I am. And Agape will be glad to be your right arm.
Mm-hmm. Be your quarterback for execution of this. And he said, I'm in. Mm. And I met with our other mayor. We have Shelby County Mayor. Right. And Mayor Harris said. I'm in and, and so we launched back in November what was called the Memphis Hope Summit, and we had nearly 500 people register to attend. Wow. Uh, and it was made up of political, nonprofit for-profit companies, churches.
Mm-hmm. Governmental. All different kinds of people coming together. And we [00:41:00] launched this event, Dr. Chan Hellman, giving leadership with many others speaking. Um, wow. And that led to, okay, we need folks now, organizations, churches, nonprofits, companies that would say, we're going to take this Hope Model Goals Pathway Agency, and we're going to begin using it in some kind of way.
We have 34 entities. Churches, companies, not who are using it. Right now, we have consultants coming in, meeting with them, saying, how's that going? How well, what's that looking like within your organization? For Agape, we're becoming a hope centered organization so that my staff, what's your level of hope staff?
Mm-hmm. 'cause if you, the higher level of hope you have, the better our clients and families are gonna do because of your hope level. Mm-hmm. Uh, and so there are lots of ways of doing this. We have our next, uh, hope, Memphis Hope Summit this coming November, and we're gonna highlight what has happened and so we believe this will begin changing the culture.
Mm-hmm. The language, how we view ourself, how we talk about ourself, uh, in the name of Jesus, and whether you're [00:42:00] a person of faith or not saying hope, we are a city of hope. Mm-hmm. And so, so we have gone deep in what does it look like for hope, because the end of hope really is leading to wellbeing and flourishing.
Uh, and, and so, so we've embraced that deeply in Memphis.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. Alright. Lemme ask you a Bible question.
David Jordan: Uhoh
Mike Glenn: the famous question of the, uh, the lawyer who's talking to Jesus and says, who is my neighbor? Mm-hmm. Okay. You've used the term neighborhood a lot.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: David, where is my neighborhood?
David Jordan: Hmm mm-hmm.
Um, my neighbor. And my neighborhood is the one I can see and feel and love and know. Um, you, you, you, you mentioned I 40, there's so many ways that we have, uh, [00:43:00] allowed ourself not to see our neighbor, not to walk by our neighbor. Maybe walk on the other side.
Right.
David Jordan: Uh, so the, uh, so my neighbor is, uh. Can I see your face?
Can IS can I hear your heart? Can I look into your eyes?
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Can I see the, uh, if a staff member says, can I see the whites of your eyes? Mm-hmm. Can I intently look at you so that you now are a person? You are made in God's image. And, and I have love for you. I don't have sympathy for you. And I know that you and I are made just by the very same, God made the very same kind of way, and we have the very same kind of desires and needs and wants.
Mm-hmm. Can I feel and know you in that kind level. So then we begin walking together. It's not me over you, but it's hand in hand. Mm-hmm. As we walk out life together, can I be that kind of, so ultimately. Am I a neighbor?
Mike Glenn: Yeah. To be a neighbor. I figured to say you sound, you sound like, [00:44:00] you know Jesus flipped the question, you know, every time.
Yeah, I guess so. Yeah. So it's not so much who, who is my neighbor, but, but I think one of, one of, you know, when I was growing up, the church was to reach the world mm-hmm. The whole world. Mm-hmm. And that, that became. You know, you're going everywhere, so you're going nowhere. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, but what, what does it mean to reach, uh, edge Hill?
Mm-hmm. Or the communities in, uh mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Uh, in, in, in Memphis. Mm-hmm. Uh, that, that, that you have named. Mm-hmm. It's, it's not, mm-hmm. It's not, you're not even reaching all of Memphis. Mm-hmm. Okay. Because again, if you're going everywhere, you're going nowhere. Mm-hmm. We're going to this community.
Mm-hmm. We're being invited to this community and this community, Fairfax was it? Mm-hmm. Is so big by, so big.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: You know, and if we're going to leave Fairfax, well will have to be invited mm-hmm. To the next neighborhood over.
David Jordan: That's right. That's right. And, you know, and I think Jesus gives us paradoxes all the time.
Um. He took the [00:45:00] 12, as we all know. Mm-hmm. And he touched the world.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: We, we live in a time that we we're probably two and three degrees away from touching every person in the world. Yeah. And, and so, uh, can I be very singular and walk with a very person from person in front of me? Mm-hmm. Uh, and will God use that to touch the whole world?
Mm-hmm. I believe believe both will be true.
Mike Glenn: Right?
David Jordan: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Okay. So, um, gosh, and I'm just. I have a, uh, a, uh, uh, pastored, uh, for 45 years or so. I think most church members are bored outta their minds. Mm. In that, um, we don't ask anything of them. Mm. Okay. A good church member attends Mm. And a good church member gives.
Yeah. Yeah. And that's all we want out of them. Mm. Now what happens with that is they don't, they don't have a reason to show up. So worship becomes something I go to [00:46:00] that somebody brings to me. Right. I'm not bringing my own worship in. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, I imagine David, there are times when you go to worship when you are there to celebrate something you saw happen that previous week.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I'm here to praise God for what I saw Thursday. You bet. Okay. Most of our folks don't have that story. Mm. Most of our folks don't have a reason to be now discipleship for most of us is attending a class. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's not preparing for ministry. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But if I have dealt with a, a father.
Who hasn't been a good father. Mm-hmm. Maybe been in prison coming out mm-hmm. Whatever. Mm-hmm. He's trying to reconnect with his family. Mm-hmm. Then that's going to drive me to study what the, what the word says about fatherhood. Yeah. And what God shows us as being a father. Yeah, that's right. Okay. So that drives a discipleship, which drives the worship.
Mm-hmm. And anytime you hang around the father, you hear about his heartbreak for the world. That's right. That's right. And then that drives the work. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. [00:47:00] Mm-hmm. Uh, and it's not, yeah, I'm not here. I, I, I'm gonna be clumsy in how I say this. I know. Mm. I'm not here because I want to do something.
I'm here out of a, because I've been compelled to by Christ to come. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You know, and I don't want to go back to him empty handed. Yeah. Yeah. And, and that, and, and, and that worship experience. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And now we are in a, when we're in a place now where. We have had, we've had, we've had the war on poverty.
Mm-hmm. We've had the great society, we've had untold billions spent. Mm mm mm And made no. Real difference mm-hmm. In poverty, except some, uh, statistics say that there's even more people in poverty now. Mm. Mm-hmm. And, uh mm-hmm. And, and that kind of stuff. So everything from, uh, single parents mm-hmm. Uh, uh, dropping outta high school.
Mm-hmm. Uh, all, [00:48:00] all the, the things that happened, uh, uh, with that. Mm-hmm. Uh, my story was, um. I'm sitting watching the news and the, and the story broke about all the children sleeping on the floor. Mm of um mm-hmm. Of, uh, DSS. Mm-hmm. The Department of Children's Services, DCS. Yes. Yeah. They were sleeping, they were sleeping on the floor of the offices.
Yep, yep, yep. So I called the Governor's chief of Staff who happened to know, and I said, listen, I'm watching this. This is not gonna stand Jack. Mm-hmm. We've gotta do something about this. Mm-hmm. Now, how, what, how do you want me to help the governor? Mm-hmm. I can, uh, I can call a couple of pastors, we'll meet with him, we'll get something going.
Mm-hmm. Or. I can have 12,000 Baptists call him in the morning. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's right. However, I need to help him. That's right, that's right. I'll do that. That's right. So we got the meeting with the governor, uh, Margie Quinn was in there from Oh yeah. From UCS Commissioner of DCS. That's right.
Uh, who's doing a really good job. Yes. And that was when it was laid out to us, [00:49:00] um, how difficult and messy this process is. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Uh, you know, we always have this Norman Rockwell view of adoption. Mm-hmm. Little blind headed, blue eyed girl. Mm-hmm. Yep. You know, and, and that kind of stuff. Yeah.
But she started telling us about different levels of children. Some of these kids you cannot take home. That's right. Yeah. It's, it's dangerous to you and your family. Yeah. And there has to be a whole nother facility for these folks. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Uh, and then you start thinking, oh, I have no idea. Yeah.
Yeah. Uh, what, what to do here, what, what to do next. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah. So, uh, what would, what would be a, an easy next step for somebody who's, who's, who's too scared to, to even call Agape and say, Hey, I'm interested in volunteering. Yeah. Or, I wanna know more about your ministry.
David Jordan: Yeah.
Mike Glenn: Okay. I just, I just want,
David Jordan: yeah.
Mm-hmm. [00:50:00] Yeah. Yeah. I, I, I do think the, the easy next step, which can be the hardest step, uh, is, is, is to, to, I need to talk to somebody. Mm-hmm. I just need to have a, kinda like what you did. Right. You know, I need to have a conversation. Mm-hmm. I need to learn more. I need to hear more.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: My, my heart's being pricked.
Mike Glenn: Same, same thing. State Gaines did.
David Jordan: Exactly. Yeah. And, and it may. May or may not come from the most purest of motivation or, um, whatever leads you to that place, it may come outta guilt. Mm-hmm. It may come out lots of places.
Mike Glenn: Again, any door that opens.
David Jordan: So, so be Yes. And, and so can I find somebody to have a serious conversation with, um, who can help me further?
'cause, because it's. As you said, uh, the typically there's gonna be misinformation mm-hmm. Or lack of information or
Mike Glenn: too much information.
David Jordan: Yes.
Mike Glenn: I mean, it's almost, you wanna throw your hands up and say, I, I can't do anything,
David Jordan: be overwhelmed.
Mike Glenn: So you don't [00:51:00] do anything at
David Jordan: all. Yeah. I mean, you wanna talk about the foster care system.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: What do you want me to do? Mm-hmm. And most people could quickly, well, I can't foster, I can't adopt. Mm-hmm. You know, and, and there are very few people that. In my opinion, need to do that.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: Um, there are a lot of people who could step in and, and have impact. Mm-hmm. But you need to understand what all that means.
Mm-hmm. Um, and, and, and so I mean, there, there's a church here, the Church of the City. Mm-hmm. That, that is one of the three, uh, strategic partners that are, uh, agape iss. One of them, there's a, a ministry in Knoxville. The governor and the state have said, uh, we wanna work with you to go deeper as backbone organizations.
Right. To, to holistically, if we wrap around, so go deep in relationship. Mm-hmm. So have those conversations. That person who says, man, I'm pricked. What can I do? Is there anything I can really do? Mm-hmm. Well, the, an answer almost always is there's something you can do. So what does that look like? And then the system of care that organizations like Agape or the Church of the City here.
Mm-hmm. There's a group in Knoxville, Knoxville Leadership Foundation, uh, that, that [00:52:00] we are, uh, working with many, like 2, 3, 400 nonprofits and others that doing good. Right. So when you have the family in the center, you have the resources and kind of early moment. Mm-hmm. You talked about the pathway, having access, and then you have people of God who want to do good and well, but what's my role?
And then being able to be within that
Mike Glenn: and who are gifted.
David Jordan: Yes. Yes.
Mike Glenn: And it's everything from I'm a financial planner. Well, you can sit down with a family and help them. You bet them. Get a fund, you can do their taxes.
David Jordan: Yeah, that's
Mike Glenn: right. And one of the things that our church did in the local community was do taxes.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Uh, for folks. That's right. And, you know, these kind of, kind of basic skills, that kind of stuff. Yep. Why do you, why are you so involved in the school? One of the things that that, that I told our churches is you have to adopt a local school.
David Jordan: Agree. Agree.
Mike Glenn: You have to go into the principal and say,
David Jordan: yeah,
Mike Glenn: we have no agenda.
We're here to help. Tell us what you need.
David Jordan: Yeah. Yeah. Uh, we are in schools because that's where the vast majority of the kids [00:53:00] are gonna be at. Um. Not everybody's gonna come to a church from the community because of past experiences. Mm-hmm. Um, and so I believe the kingdom is in the, the sacred sector clearly, and it's in the, the secular sector.
And, and so we go in schools, we partner alongside, uh, we're clear, we're Christian based, we also are clear of things we can and cannot do. And we say. We come in, in the name of Jesus, whether we say that out loud or not. Mm-hmm. Um, and we bring holistic resources in those schools as a good partner. Uh, so, uh, for me, uh, I believe the kingdom is over.
All life matters. And so go to where the people are at. That's where a significant number mm-hmm. Of the people are at. Um, and then the pragmatics of if you don't do well in school, the likelihood of a job, all the kind of things. Mm-hmm. You know, just being able to, to have pathways while on this earth toward job and functioning and all [00:54:00] the matters.
That begins in early childhood, that's K 12. Mm-hmm. And then that, that, that then moves into, are you doing two year, four year? Are you doing certificates toward a job? Whatever. Those kind of, and, and so being in the, being in those places to give pathway in that kind of way.
Mike Glenn: Yeah. We were stunned to find out that the average teacher in Tennessee spends $5,000 a year
David Jordan: Mm.
Outta their own pocket
Mike Glenn: of their own money. Yep. To supply their children.
David Jordan: Yep, yep, yep. And, and especially if you're in a public school system.
Mike Glenn: Yes.
David Jordan: Yes. Um, I'm not saying private teachers. Yeah. Uh, and, and so my wife's been on both sides, uh, in, in her past. Um, that is true. That is true. And, and so first of all, God bless teachers.
In the classroom who stay at it Amen. And are doing it and are being asked to do more than really what they should be doing. Right. You know, can you be the social worker, can you be all the kind of things. And so, uh, bless them. And then for churches and others who would hear that? [00:55:00] Uh, man, how do we support a teacher and, and so money coming outta their pocket mm-hmm.
And what does it mean for their classroom and all the dynamics going on in a classroom. So, so, yes. I mean Right. And that's a, that's another great example. Mm-hmm. Of another way of how can we help?
Mike Glenn: Okay. Alright. I'm all fired up. What do I do next?
David Jordan: Well, you call Matt, call Pastor Mike Glenn, or you can call David Jordan.
Um. Uh, you need to talk to somebody. Somebody that you know, can get me to somewhere. Yes. To have a conversation to how do I move this passion forward? 'cause it will fizzle out. Mm-hmm. If it's left just a passion. Mm-hmm. Uh, Satan will wanna stomp that out. Mm-hmm. Um, so, so make a call, r reach out, have a next conversation mm-hmm.
With someone as a trusted advisor, an elder, a shepherd, a good friend, uh,
Mike Glenn: agape website is agape. So
David Jordan: we're, we're Agape means love.org.
Mike Glenn: Okay. Agape means [00:56:00] love.org.
David Jordan: Yeah. In Memphis. Mm-hmm. And so if you're in the Memphis area or are there ways that we can help mm-hmm. Uh, help, help in terms of your direction?
You know, let me know. Uh, there are lots of great nonprofits and churches and others here in the Nashville, greater Nashville area, this metro area. Uh, find somebody who could help you further that conversation and know Satan will try to stamp it out.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm.
David Jordan: He will work. To stop that conversation. Mm-hmm.
So persevere through that to continue in the, the passion god's given.
Mike Glenn: Well, it, it, it's worse because if you, if you get. Emotional about something, but don't take action, then it becomes like a callous.
David Jordan: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mike Glenn: You keep rubbing that spot over and over again. Mm-hmm. Yes. And it becomes callous.
David Jordan: Yes.
Mike Glenn: And pretty soon you don't respond at all.
David Jordan: That's right. That's right.
Mike Glenn: With that, that's right. But there are enough areas and enough opportunities for all kinds of gifts.
David Jordan: Yes, yes,
Mike Glenn: yes. For people to, to make a difference.
David Jordan: Yes.
Mike Glenn: And this was one of, uh. As, as I tell people, Jesus told us what was on the final and he gave us the questions in Matthew 25, I was
David Jordan: mm-hmm.
Hmm. Yep.
Mike Glenn: [00:57:00] Hungry. I was in prison. That's right. I was right. And you came and, and saw about me.
David Jordan: And, and I think it's important within that, something you said a moment ago, um, if you had a bad experience or there's something that you would point to, to say it doesn't work. Mm-hmm. It didn't work. I got burnt. I got hurt.
It. Don't allow that, that experience was real, I'm sure. Mm-hmm. But don't allow that to be globalized as your overall next step.
Mike Glenn: Right.
David Jordan: Don't let that determine what you do next.
Mike Glenn: Good. Good word.
David Jordan: Um, otherwise, Satan, he, he has done exactly what he's trying to do.
Mike Glenn: Mm-hmm. Well, David, thank you for your time. It is good, good and real honor to have you, and
David Jordan: thank you so much.
Mike Glenn: Hear about your work and about the work of Agape Memphis.
David Jordan: Thank you, sir.
